The Va is not your friend.

Nomad.2nd · Sep 17, 2014

No, this isn't me.

...but it could be.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...92304936.97576.100002266371223&type=1&theater

Vermiform · Sep 17, 2014

Nomad said:
No, this isn't me.

...but it could be.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...92304936.97576.100002266371223&type=1&theater

I'm skeptical because I don't know the gentleman's circumstances. Usually fuduciaries were enacted only because patients had shown that they could not manage their funds and were blowing their checks on street drugs or alcohol or the family members were abusing the funds because of the patient's age. That said, these new rules are ripe for abuse because there is no judge involved in the decision that ultimately strips gun rights from the patients. Also, even though there is an appeals process, last I checked there was a 2 year backlog and that was before these new rules went into effect.

Nomad.2nd · Sep 17, 2014

Vermiform said:
I'm skeptical because I don't know the gentleman's circumstances. Usually fuduciaries were enacted only because patients had shown that they could not manage their funds and were blowing their checks on street drugs or alcohol or the family members were abusing the funds because of the patient's age. That said, these new rules are ripe for abuse because there is no judge involved in the decision that ultimately strips gun rights from the patients. Also, even though there is an appeals process, last I checked there was a 2 year backlog and that was before these new rules went into effect.

^ my issue.

Nomad.2nd · Sep 18, 2014

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/0...-warned-isis-urging-jihad-attacks-on-us-soil/

Thought this was a fitting place...

tim9lives · Sep 18, 2014

I am not at the least bit surprised. PTSD will probably be used more and more as a reason to ban an individuals right to own firearms.

All it takes is a overly cautious mental health professional flagging an individual who is receiving disability benefits.

Hitman · Sep 18, 2014

It's very possible this guy may not be able to do either :dunno:

Does anyone know him personally? he may very well be a loon?

I know plenty of people who have 30% or less VA C&P from PTSD
that have never received such a letter.

This is initiated for something beyond a simple C&P Rating.

4thMiss · Sep 19, 2014

The VA Sucks!

Emperor · Sep 19, 2014

I'm not even going to get started! However I will throw this out there. Why is there an emphasis on telling these guys in the letter about the prohibition of obtaining a firearm?

Sits while blood boils!

Vermiform · Sep 19, 2014

Emperor said:
I'm not even going to get started! However I will throw this out there. Why is there an emphasis on telling these guys in the letter about the prohibition of obtaining a firearm?

Sits while blood boils!

Reporting requirements and/or policy changed with VA Hospitals. If you receive a Fiduciary Judgement (deemed unable to manage your own finances, ie: your VA Check) they are now turning you over to NICS.

Emperor · Sep 19, 2014

Vermiform said:
Reporting requirements and/or policy changed with VA Hospitals. If you receive a Fiduciary Judgement (deemed unable to manage your own finances, ie: your VA Check) they are now turning you over to NICS.

So, you volunteer to serve your country; they send you off to war; you get unbelievable images of death and killing permanently ingrained in your head while you're there; you come home and get treated like a leper; and when you seek help they screw you out of benefits and take your Right to protect yourself away from you.

You Vets tell me! Do you think your comrades with PTSD are this much of a threat to themselves and others?

Vermiform · Sep 19, 2014

Emperor said:
So, you volunteer to serve your country; they send you off to war; you get unbelievable images of death and killing permanently ingrained in your head while you're there; you come home and get treated like a leper; and when you seek help they screw you out of benefits and take your Right to protect yourself away from you.

You Vets tell me! Do you think your comrades with PTSD are this much of a threat to themselves and others?

Not sure if we are there yet though. Re-read my first post in this thread.

Personally I think the only thing protecting this from being abused is the sheer volume of paperwork it takes to make a Fiduciary happen. In my personal experience someone had to be really fcking up PROPER to have one handed down, OR an aged vet in question had several volumes documented on the family not looking out for his well being and abusing his check. Now they could eventually streamline the process........

JadeRaven · Sep 19, 2014

Wow.

Stuff like this is going to have a huge chilling effect on vets and others who seek treatment for PTSD.

However as others have said, the guy very well might be incompetent. Just because you can post stuff on facebook does not mean you are of sound mind.

Edit: I just realized re-reading this stuff that it's about financial incompetence. Another wow. I wonder if they say he's financially incompetent because of the PTSD, or just because of his mismanaging his own money?

Emperor · Sep 19, 2014

Vermiform said:
Not sure if we are there yet though. Re-read my first post in this thread.

Personally I think the only thing protecting this from being abused is the sheer volume of paperwork it takes to make a Fiduciary happen. In my personal experience someone had to be really fcking up PROPER to have one handed down, OR an aged vet in question had several volumes documented on the family not looking out for his well being and abusing his check. Now they could eventually streamline the process........

I'm tracking the firearms prohibition in this though, mostly. If PTSD and chronic pain is the reason this guy is being issued this letter; then I suppose we would have to know the degree of his PTSD. The reason I ask above is, if the feds are going to allow a Psych Dr. to determine whether or not someone has PTSD, what benchmark is going to be used to decide where the line is to deny them possession of firearms? Thereafter, if they think someone is too unstable to own a firearm, then I want to know if regular citizens should fear vets with any form of PTSD?

So, I ask again; what do you fellow vets think? Would you trust another vet who had PTSD in the duck blind with you? Rabbit hunting? At a skeet range? A USPSA shoot?

Vermiform · Sep 19, 2014

Emperor said:
I'm tracking the firearms prohibition in this though, mostly. If PTSD and chronic pain is the reason this guy is being issued this letter; then I suppose we would have to know the degree of his PTSD. The reason I ask above is, if the feds are going to allow a Psych Dr. to determine whether or not someone has PTSD, what benchmark is going to be used to decide where the line is to deny them possession of firearms? Thereafter, if they think someone is too unstable to own a firearm, then I want to know if regular citizens should fear vets with any form of PTSD?

Bottom line, there should be a judge involved and there is not. Unfortunately they are going to have to start really abusing this before a test case is produced and a court challenge brought.

Nomad.2nd · Sep 19, 2014

Emperor said:
So, I ask again; what do you fellow vets think? Would you trust another vet who had PTSD in the duck blind with you? Rabbit hunting? At a skeet range? A USPSA shoot?

they say a buddy of mine (and me, even though I've refused to be evaluated or answer questions) has PTSD.

I lent him a G19 for his future wife To train with as she doesn't like his 23

He ain't killed me yet!

My problem is the lack of due process.... Setting aside the issue of a liberal shrink (what are THOSE odds!?!)
There IS a process, of letters, of Informing the vet of the vet having time to respond, of a hearing (NOT in a court or anything... Much like the ATF making law...)

Problem is:
It's the EXACT same process that DID NOT HAPPEN AT ALL When they pulled my pension without informing me in any way. (on their records they have that they TRIED to call me 1x... Which I doubt.) when I asked a Dr appointment be rescheduled..... And they SKIPPED COMPLETELY (illegally) the ENTIRE PROCESS with the first I knew about it being my pension didn't hit. (like many, I elected to receive my medical retirement from the VA rather than the Marine Corps due to it being tax free)
Fortunately my service officer s a buddy and fixed it pretty promptly.... Whereas I Understand THIS has a 2 year backlog before the appeals process can START!

... It's called due process for a reason.

bjeepin2 · Sep 19, 2014

I live in a home of 5 marines all have ptsd to some point or another, some paid for some not. that said there are days all the guns in the house stay locked up and some we all go shooting at the range together. 2 have our CCW, 2 are going to get theirs, one no way in hell is that going to happen.

Rainsdrops · Sep 19, 2014

Funny, the vet is incompetent, can't manage his finances, irresponsible with firearms, yes can read the document with understanding.. Love it.

rtr_rtr · Sep 19, 2014

Rainsdrops said:
Funny, the vet is incompetent, can't manage his finances, irresponsible with firearms, yes can read the document with understanding.. Love it.

Most patients with schizophrenia, suicidal ideation, mania, etc read and understand what they're reading just fine. Not like it's The Sound and the Fury.

The Va is not your friend.

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