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  1. #61
    Shooter John_'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitebread View Post
    As I made my shift into adulthood I knew pot really was no big deal, but thought it should be illegal anyways because I didn't fully understand the rights of man. As I matured it became clear to me that we are either free to do as we wish or we are not. At this point was the point in which I decided silly things like the criminalization of a natural herb is foolish and only constrains the rights of free men and women.
    Poppy is a natural occurring plant too. So based on your analogy, you think use of opium and heroin is fine too?
    What about coca leaves? Just a harmless herb eh?
    Nothing wrong with an 18 year old smoking a little crack with ur daughter and going for a drive?

    Think about this....marijuana usage and sales remains a violation of federal law, just as cocaine or heroin. This is the prime reason banks and the banking industry will not tender marijuana business cash/transactions in any way, no matter legalization at the state level. But under the liberal Obama administration the last 8 years, the marijuana experiment was allowed to flourish. So how does our POTUS determine just which laws he shall enforce, and which he doesn't? I thought our president's sworn oath at the onset of his administration was to enforce ALL of the federal laws of the USA?

  2. #62
    Not a Fed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sliguns View Post
    What do they deserve?
    Fired and maybe charges
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    The problems we face today are
    there because the people who work
    for a living are outnumbered by those
    who vote for a living.




  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by John_ View Post
    Poppy is a natural occurring plant too. So based on your analogy, you think use of opium and heroin is fine too?
    What about coca leaves? Just a harmless herb eh?
    Nothing wrong with an 18 year old smoking a little crack with ur daughter and going for a drive?

    Think about this....marijuana usage and sales remains a violation of federal law, just as cocaine or heroin. This is the prime reason banks and the banking industry will not tender marijuana business cash/transactions in any way, no matter legalization at the state level. But under the liberal Obama administration the last 8 years, the marijuana experiment was allowed to flourish. So how does our POTUS determine just which laws he shall enforce, and which he doesn't? I thought our president's sworn oath at the onset of his administration was to enforce ALL of the federal laws of the USA?
    Would you want your child riding around with some goofy gun nut. That's the democrats argument. You are conflating topics. Ben Franklin was famous for using poppies and keeping the company of prostitutes. I'm not gonna argue about how different it is for a minor to use a substance harvested and refined from a plant, than an adult burning one on his own time. I have no vested interest in make weed legal. And, yes I find the scourge of substance abuse in this country sad and shameful but just because it's bad for someone doesn't mean you and I have a right to tell them they can't partake. Rights are a funny thing. My right to be an idiot ends when it affects your right to ________. That's how I see the world.

  4. #64
    Marksman MOTOR51's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitebread View Post
    Would you want your child riding around with some goofy gun nut. That's the democrats argument. You are conflating topics. Ben Franklin was famous for using poppies and keeping the company of prostitutes. I'm not gonna argue about how different it is for a minor to use a substance harvested and refined from a plant, than an adult burning one on his own time. I have no vested interest in make weed legal. And, yes I find the scourge of substance abuse in this country sad and shameful but just because it's bad for someone doesn't mean you and I have a right to tell them they can't partake. Rights are a funny thing. My right to be an idiot ends when it affects your right to ________. That's how I see the world.
    What about when they don't have a job and you are paying for their medical bills and rehab due to drug abuse. Same with seat belts, it's all a personal choice until someone else is covering your medical bills.


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  5. #65
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    They are engineering strains of CBD, to treat many many health issues. Also there could be a breakthrough using a new CBD technique to target cancer cells only. It's a crazy plant. CBD being the relax factor in marijuana. Engineered CBD plants don't produce THC. Can't get high on them.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by MOTOR51 View Post
    What about when they don't have a job and you are paying for their medical bills and rehab due to drug abuse. Same with seat belts, it's all a personal choice until someone else is covering your medical bills.


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    True dat. If you are surviving of the peassure or others you don't have the same rights as one who pays their own way. And if we study the theories behind he rights of man and where my rights end and yours begin we will see that. It's the "golden rule: the one who holds the gold makes the rules."

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by alpinehyperlite View Post
    DOB
    LMAO! you're a whole day older than me!

    Edit: Wait... are you trying to spread my personal information? You stalking me? That's kind of creepy if you are!
    Last edited by whitsend; January 9th, 2017 at 10:21 AM.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitebread View Post
    I've spent the last eight or nine years with kind of a half chub (God I hope I don't get dinged for that)
    Have you been typing with it and that's why your grammar is so atrocious?

  9. #69
    Marksman Trailboss's Avatar
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    Y'all are getting sidetracted on whether pot should be legal or not. My contention in post #6 was that non-felony legal violations should not be applied as an infringement to a constitutional right. When you are incarcerated with a felony conviction, you forfeit many constitutional rights.

    By the way, did you know that the courts have held that you can lie on the 4473 form under protection of the 5th amendment that says you do not have to self-incriminate yourself? I still hold the opinion that the Brady Bill requiring this expensive government bureaucracy is an infringement of the 2nd Amendment.

    Actually, the camel's nose came through the tent flaps with the National Firearms Act of 1934 and the Gun Control Act of 1968 brought the camel's front feet into the tent. Now, 82 and 48 years later, very few people are left that remember what real 2nd amendment freedom is like. Another 20 years, even constitutional conservatives will believe the Brady Bill is a reasonable infringement. I think the only good thing in the Brady Bill was the 10-yr expiration of the greater than 10-round magazine ban.
    "Incrementalism" is the weapon used by anti-gun forces to destroy the second amendment.
    "Compromise" is a negotiation term that can only be used one time - when you compromise a compromise, you have lost the entire issue.

    GOOD whisky never lets you loose your place

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trailboss View Post
    Y'all are getting sidetracted on whether pot should be legal or not. My contention in post #6 was that non-felony legal violations should not be applied as an infringement to a constitutional right. When you are incarcerated with a felony conviction, you forfeit many constitutional rights.

    By the way, did you know that the courts have held that you can lie on the 4473 form under protection of the 5th amendment that says you do not have to self-incriminate yourself? I still hold the opinion that the Brady Bill requiring this expensive government bureaucracy is an infringement of the 2nd Amendment.

    Actually, the camel's nose came through the tent flaps with the National Firearms Act of 1934 and the Gun Control Act of 1968 brought the camel's front feet into the tent. Now, 82 and 48 years later, very few people are left that remember what real 2nd amendment freedom is like. Another 20 years, even constitutional conservatives will believe the Brady Bill is a reasonable infringement. I think the only good thing in the Brady Bill was the 10-yr expiration of the greater than 10-round magazine ban.
    You are absolutely right. But it's not just guns it's everything. I know people probably get sick of reading my post about the founders, but I in my core believe we owe our founders a debt to at a bare minimum honor their wishes. We are currently so far from those values I would be afraid to here what Thomas Jefferson would say today.

  11. #71
    Marksman Nathan Hale's Avatar
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    Should the federal gov't be able to deny a constitutional right to an individual who engages in behavior that is not illegal on the state level?
    That is the question.
    (Remember the 10th amendment.)

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitebread View Post
    You are absolutely right. But it's not just guns it's everything. I know people probably get sick of reading my post about the founders, but I in my core believe we owe our founders a debt to at a bare minimum honor their wishes. We are currently so far from those values I would be afraid to here what Thomas Jefferson would say today.
    Keep preaching, more people need to be of this mindset... Constant restrictions on law abiding citizens, and weaker sentences for sex offenders and violent criminals is a problem that seriously needs to be addressed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nathan Hale View Post
    Should the federal gov't be able to deny a constitutional right to an individual who engages in behavior that is not illegal on the state level?
    That is the question.
    (Remember the 10th amendment.)
    Nope... I firmly believe the states should be able to rule themselves sovereignly!

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nathan Hale View Post
    Should the federal gov't be able to deny a constitutional right to an individual who engages in behavior that is not illegal on the state level?
    That is the question.
    (Remember the 10th amendment.)
    Careful now you know the leftist hear 10th A and visualize this.



    God forbid someone think for themselves.


    I do not support nor do I think Mr. Hale would endorse the above picture, however this is the cartoonish belief of the lefties.
    Last edited by Whitebread; January 7th, 2017 at 11:04 AM. Reason: For clarity

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeeperCreeper View Post
    Keep preaching, more people need to be of this mindset... Constant restrictions on law abiding citizens, and weaker sentences for sex offenders and violent criminals is a problem that seriously needs to be addressed.



    Nope... I firmly believe the states should be able to rule themselves sovereignly!
    Yeah I whole heartedly agree. An interesting tidbit about America in her infancy. The people wanted to support France in their revolution. And the administration (John Adams was president at the time) wanted to straddle the fence and tried to play line Switzerland did in WWI and WWII, succession was first discussed then and the federalist (this is you modern day war hawks like McCain and Graham) were ready to stomp that down. So just to show you guys even many of the founders had great difficulty not betraying their ideals.

  15. #75
    Mad Scientist Vsotok10's Avatar
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    We all know that weed smokers are the ones we have to fear the most! If you think its appropriate to infringe on the rights of others who fit into some class, just remember that you too are part of one class or another.

    First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
    Because I was not a Socialist.

    Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
    Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

    Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
    Because I was not a Jew.

    Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

    Martin Niemöller
    "The Price of Freedom is the willingness to do sudden battle, anywhere, at any time, and with utter recklessness"....Robert A. Heinlein
    "An Armed Society is a Polite Society"....Robert A. Heinlein

  16. #76
    Shooter John_'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeeperCreeper View Post
    Nope... I firmly believe the states should be able to rule themselves sovereignly!
    That was the main causal of the american civil war. And we know how that played out in the end.

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by John_ View Post
    That was the main causal of the american civil war. And we know how that played out in the end.
    Yep the destruction of the 10th can be hung squarely on Honest Abe and the Yanks.

  18. #78
    Marksman UnseenUSPCompact's Avatar
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    I check out for a few weeks and get to come back to this gem...

  19. #79
    Marksman sliguns's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnseenUSPCompact View Post
    I check out for a few weeks and get to come back to this gem...
    "Liberty is lost through complacency and a subservient mindset. America was born of protest, revolution and mistrust of government. Subservient societies neither maintain nor deserve freedom for long" - Ron Paul

    "I can sacrifice my liberties, and you can sacrifice yours, but I cannot sacrifice yours; neither can a majority in Congress sacrifice yours or mine." - Judge Andrew Napolitano

  20. #80
    Marksman UnseenUSPCompact's Avatar
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    The issue of weed being a crime or not is not the question. It's obviously a crime, I don't think anybody is arguing that. The argument is the reason its a crime and if it should remain a crime. The intelligent researched answer should be an obvious 'no'. Just because things are illegal now doesn't mean they should or shouldn't change. Laws need to evolve and change as we become better at understanding reasons and consequences. Weed is not legal for many political and business reason, there is no rational reason for it to be illegal. Its the same thing as other groups crying for gun control to save human life then ignore all the other ways to protect or better human life. They want gun control for political or ideological reasons the same way many people want weed to remain illegal for political and ideological and business reasons. I don't fault a LEO for following the laws as they stand, that is their job, but to harass or demean citizens that believe a ridiculous law needs to change is absolutely disgraceful. Bill Murray had a great quote that he said jokingly but I believe shows the pathetic nature of these laws. "I find it ironic that the most dangerous thing about weed is being caught with it." Any person, LEO and civilian alike, that takes longer than 2 seconds to research the topic should understand that weed does not ruin families, weed laws ruin families, the government creating these laws ruin families.

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