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  • John_

    Shooter
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    So I am doing a bit of research on handgun finishes. Traditional hot tank bluing seems to have gone away completely, the older style like Colt and S&W used to apply. Polish the metal to a mirror finish then hot tank blue. Colt deep blue finish (from the 1970s, 1980s) was probably the best bluing finish I can recall. Seems I recall there was some negative EPA environmental aspects of hot bluing. Perhaps that is why it went away?

    Tenifer on the Glocks seems like an extremely durable finish. I purchased a used G22 gen 3 which was a LEO trade in and the tenifer finish was polished, almost gone in some smaller spots on the slide from holster wear. I found out from other posters here even tho the tenifer finish appears gone, polished away, the tenifer remains, still corrosion resistant. Just now i read that Tenifer and salt bath nitriding, or melonite, are the same finish.

    So I recently purchased a Canik PT9SFX made in Turkey. The slide is cerakoted, which from what I have read is subject to holster wear long term, and chipping. Why would anyone coat their slide in cerakote versus melonite? I guess for the color options available in cerakote. Melonite is way more durable, but def color limited.

    Perhaps cerakote is cheaper to apply? Spray and bake sort of deal. Must be cheaper that salt bath nitriding in manufacturing. Nitriding involves more metal prep, polishing, heated tanks, ect.

    Then there is hard chrome and nickel finishes. Extensive polishing of metal to a mirror finish, multiple plating tanks/steps. Clearly more labor intensive.

    Cerakote doesn't require that mirror like polishing. Light sandblasting for prep, spray on then bake to dry/harden finish. The cerakote finish has to be cheapest to apply.

    Robar has a NP3 finish that co-deposits sub-micron particles of PTFE or teflon. Gonna have to read up on this process.

    Ok, I know a lot of you out there have cerakoted pistols and ARs, how does it hold up? Does it chip long term? Experiences, good or bad?

    Encouraging discussion of firearms finishes/re-finishing here. Experiences, on your wish list. Refinishing you have done yourself (cold bluing perhaps), or had a vendor or shop apply.

    Any other options not mentioned above?

    Or your personal favorite?
     
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    machinedrummer

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    My friends dad had a Dan Wesson .357 in a presentation box that had multiple barrels. It was a blued revolver. I tell you it was a thing of beauty. I love the old finishes. Stocks and Metal seemed to be works of art rather than whatever it’s called today.
     

    mukwah

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    All of my firearms are either blued or stainless steel. I have several long guns that I refinished in Duracoat. Long process but they have held up well. I also have a Charter Arms Pug in nitride finish. The shorty shotty is a Remington Wingmaster I picked up full of rust. Took it down to bare metal and refinished it with Duracoat.
    323e66bfe385b8118cbc49ac2563ebd1.jpg
    28e42ce81f7d57b32230d15f25208066.jpg


    Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk
     

    John_

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    My friends dad had a Dan Wesson .357 in a presentation box that had multiple barrels. It was a blued revolver. I tell you it was a thing of beauty. I love the old finishes. Stocks and Metal seemed to be works of art rather than whatever it’s called today.

    Dan Wesson is another that had that rich deep mirror finish bluing way back, similar to Colt. They just don't make me like that anymore. Like the Colt Python royal blue.
     

    John_

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    All of my firearms are either blued or stainless steel. I have several long guns that I refinished in Duracoat. Long process but they have held up well. I also have a Charter Arms Pug in nitride finish. The shorty shotty is a Remington Wingmaster I picked up full of rust. Took it down to bare metal and refinished it with Duracoat.

    323e66bfe385b8118cbc49ac2563ebd1.jpg
    28e42ce81f7d57b32230d15f25208066.jpg


    Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

    I don't own a single blued weapon any more. SS yes, nitrided yes, anodized yes, cerakote yes. Oh and parkerized too. I dream I still owned a Python in royal blue.

    Nice work on the Wingmaster.
     
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    rcm192

    Sic semper tyrannis
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    Look up arts gun shop. They do restorations.....like restamp roll marks and match the bluing formula to the serial number production date restorations. Amazing work. Its who winchester refers people to from what I have heard.
     

    John_

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    Look up arts gun shop. They do restorations.....like restamp roll marks and match the bluing formula to the serial number production date restorations. Amazing work. Its who winchester refers people to from what I have heard.

    Wow, just watched a video of his "rode hard and put up wet" Browning A5 restoration. Art Isaacson, the guy is a master restorer and refinisher.
     

    John_

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    You could just do the CZ way... Thick black paint... Lol... I really need to refinish my P01...

    Yes, I just purchased my first CZ. S2, it has black polycoat on the lower, slide is nitrided (smooth polished black finish). CZ polycoat I believe is same as cerakote. CZ states the S2 lower is phosphated, then polycoated.

    From CZ USA - Q and A page:
    Black polycoat is an electrostaticly-applied powder coating that is then oven cured to a hard shell. The coating is applied over a phosphate finish which is very corrosion resistant in itself, the parts are then racked, given a negative charge and sprayed. This charged attraction literally draws the coating to the parts, reducing overspray. The parts are cured in an oven, producing a tough finish that meets Mil. Spec.

    http://cz-usa.com/support/faq/

    The black polycoat on my CZ lower is smooth as a baby's behind. A satin black finish.
     
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    sportsbud

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    Yes, I just purchased my first CZ. S2, it has black polycoat on the lower, slide is nitrided (smooth polished black finish). CZ polycoat I believe is same as cerakote. CZ states the S2 lower is phosphated, then polycoated.

    From CZ USA - Q and A page:
    Black polycoat is an electrostaticly-applied powder coating that is then oven cured to a hard shell. The coating is applied over a phosphate finish which is very corrosion resistant in itself, the parts are then racked, given a negative charge and sprayed. This charged attraction literally draws the coating to the parts, reducing overspray. The parts are cured in an oven, producing a tough finish that meets Mil. Spec.

    http://cz-usa.com/support/faq/

    The black polycoat on my CZ lower is smooth as a baby's behind. A satin black finish.

    My P01 has served me for 8 years and many thousands of rounds. The paint on the slide is chipped and dinged. As so in the frame. The frame being an aluminum alloy it is a non issue but the slide is steel. The barrel did develop some surface rust when I did not use enough oil and it sat in a humid area for a while. That freaked me out enough that I'm constantly oiling it now.
     

    John_

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    My P01 has served me for 8 years and many thousands of rounds. The paint on the slide is chipped and dinged. As so in the frame. The frame being an aluminum alloy it is a non issue but the slide is steel. The barrel did develop some surface rust when I did not use enough oil and it sat in a humid area for a while. That freaked me out enough that I'm constantly oiling it now.

    Oh yeah, I have seen pics in reviews of chips in the polycoat around the slide stop pin, when removing the slide on an S2. You should get ur barrel and slide melonited. Typical melonite finish thickness is .00004 to .00008

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferritic_nitrocarburizing

    Postoxidation black oxide

    An additional step can be added to the nitrocarburizing process called postoxidation. When properly performed, postoxidation creates a layer of black oxide (Fe3O4), that greatly increases the corrosion resistance of the treated substrate while leaving an aesthetically attractive black color. Since the introduction of the Glock pistol in 1982, this type of nitrocarburizing with postoxidation finish has become popular as a factory finish for military style handguns.
     
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    sportsbud

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    Oh yeah, I have seen pics in reviews of chips in the polycoat around the slide stop pin, when removing the slide on an S2. You should get ur barrel and slide melonited. Typical melonite finish thickness is .00004 to .00008

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferritic_nitrocarburizing

    Postoxidation black oxide

    An additional step can be added to the nitrocarburizing process called postoxidation. When properly performed, postoxidation creates a layer of black oxide (Fe3O4), that greatly increases the corrosion resistance of the treated substrate while leaving an aesthetically attractive black color. Since the introduction of the Glock pistol in 1982, this type of nitrocarburizing with postoxidation finish has become popular as a factory finish for military style handguns.

    Never thought of that. Who in the are does that? Would probably just refinish the whole thing as well.
     

    John_

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    Never thought of that. Who in the are does that? Would probably just refinish the whole thing as well.

    I don't know of anyone I have used myself, perhaps some of the other guys will chime in. I did Google melonite refinish and found some shops who perform the services.

    I just searched and Primary Machine offers black nitride refinishing, barrel and slide. Very good prices compared to some I found on the internet. We had a member here bragging on PM's machining for a rmr and his pics indicated outstanding work. And I read another excellent recommendation for rmr machining by PM on the CZ forum.

    PM site says $30 for the barrel and $60 for the stripped slide....that's the best prices I have seen on line this morning searching. They do not do the process in-house, but says a leading finisher in the USA. Primary Machine is in Morgan City. Dem guys at PM got it goin on!

    link to Primary: http://primarymachine.com/refinishing-laser-work/black-nitride-refinishing/
     

    sportsbud

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    I don't know of anyone I have used myself, perhaps some of the other guys will chime in. I did Google melonite refinish and found some shops who perform the services.

    I just searched and Primary Machine offers black nitride refinishing, barrel and slide. Very good prices compared to some I found on the internet. We had a member here bragging on PM's machining for a rmr and his pics indicated outstanding work. And I read another excellent recommendation for rmr machining by PM on the CZ forum.

    PM site says $30 for the barrel and $60 for the stripped slide....that's the best prices I have seen on line this morning searching. They do not do the process in-house, but says a leading finisher in the USA. Primary Machine is in Morgan City. Dem guys at PM got it goin on!

    link to Primary: http://primarymachine.com/refinishing-laser-work/black-nitride-refinishing/

    Well damn, that is more than fair... I may be doing that soon! Think it may be worth the extra $10 to have them strip it as well (the damn sights lol) Then I would just need to get the frame done (not melonite as it's not steel)
     

    John_

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    PM's prices are awesome! Searching this morning some shops want $350-500 to refinish the whole pistol. Cheapest I found before PM to melonite a slide alone was $200.

    $10 to strip the slide.......let em have it!
     
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    sportsbud

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    They also powder coat the frame for a good price. But complete stripping of the frame is a daunting task with the P01 lol. Since it's aluminum alloy I may just leave it lol.
     

    DH Vidrine

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    My favorite gun finish is the slow rust blue process. It looks great, more durable, safer, and requires a much less investment in equipment than the hot caustic blueing process. Slow rust blueing does require more labor but I can do it all myself. It's not that hard to do.
     

    Cbzr1107

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    My favorite finish by far is nitriding. Sure there are pluses and minuses with them all, but of all the finishes I've had or seen first hand it's seems to be the most durable.

    Some, like what are on my Dan Wesson 1911s, can become blotchy with the wrong chemicals vs I haven't heard of that happening to Glock's. I'm not sure why that is. But, I know what to use and what not to use so it isn't an issue. Their finish looks as good as the day I bought them.

    I also have a few Browning Hi-Powers. One was an import and I had a lot of work done to it. I went back and forth on what finish to use and ultimately decided to hardchrome some of the small parts and nitride the rest. Some who haven't looked into it will assume that the nitriding process would affect the welded on bushing at the end of the slide, but it doesn't. Not in the slightest.

    Hard chrome is another great finish that gets great reviews and it's been around forever as well. I'm suprised it hasn't been mentioned on here.
     
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