30-06 Medium-long range hunter bolt gun build purchase ideas ramblings

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  • Bangswitch

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    Ok I’m not the best, smartest or most experienced shooter/hunter. I may be in the top ten of people I know well enough to know their skill set. Most likely the top 25, sadly I only know twenty-six people.

    Jokes aside I know one thing for certain 30-06 is a great cartridge terminal ballistics are devastating. I’ve cleaned plenty of dear shot with it. The second thing for certain is I own one and already stock ammo. And third so do so many people which makes collecting spare brass for reloading even easier.

    So my caliber is chosen, it’s gonna be a bolt gun, and my intentions are to shoot heavy wind bucking bullets at deer, elk, hog, sheep and anything else I’m blessed enough to get the opportunity.

    What is not decided is action (rem, savage, Sako, tikka), barrel (length, twist, brand), build or buy, and stock.

    I like the idea of building it myself, but if I could buy a tikka or nicer auctioned gun set up to shoot heavy bullets from a heavy profiled barrel (I like poking holes in targets too) just buying one wouldn’t be a let down.

    One more twist to the tail: I’m a left eye dominant southpaw so we are talking lefthand actions.
     

    CG&L

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    The 30-06 is a great hunting round if you need/want the extra power. What range and group size are you looking for? A 2" group at 300yds using a 180gr bullet? The best route to go is have a rifle built.

    As far as barrel; 24", #4 contour with 1-11 twist is what I would do.
     

    Bangswitch

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    The 30-06 is a great hunting round if you need/want the extra power. What range and group size are you looking for? A 2" group at 300yds using a 180gr bullet? The best route to go is have a rifle built.

    As far as barrel; 24", #4 contour with 1-11 twist is what I would do.

    I was thinking 190 and 210 vld’s. I’m not sure I can get enough FPS to go slower than 1:10. I’m looking for .5moa or better.

    I have been considering a 1:8 twist but I never hear anyone running that fast a twist even with the heavier Berger’s, but if you play with the calculator 1:9 could be necessary in some instances. That also may be because bullets in this weight class tend to be pushed by a magnum.

    Im not married to any one bullet (albeit an expanding bullet is necessary) just the basic principles behind long heavy bullets.

    I have been reading that between 24-28 inches the 30-06 starts to walk away from the 308. And at 22 inches you are spitting unburned powder out the barrel of an ‘06. I’m a bigger guy and I have some *brush guns*, so longer barrels are not objectionable, so I wouldn’t shy away from a 26 inch barrel either.

    I forgot to mention we are talking 0-800 yards. I’ve been itching to stretch my legs. I have guns that are accurate to that range and guns that are lethal (ethically lethal), but not both currently.
     
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    Bangswitch

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    Ok so another look at Berger’s twist calculator tells me 1:10 is as fast as I should need. The 210 vld is stable in 1:10 all the way down to muzzle vel. of 1600 FPS. Which won’t expand because it’s so slow. I should be able to crank out more than enough speed to stabilize any load I would count on for long range accuracy.

    Additionally 1:11 needs 2850 FPS. to make the same bullet stable.
     
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    CG&L

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    A 210 will fit in the magazine? You may want to check first

    As I already stated ' barrel 24", #4 contour with 1-11 twist'.
     

    Bangswitch

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    A 210 will fit in the magazine? You may want to check first

    As I already stated ' barrel 24", #4 contour with 1-11 twist'.

    Ok bare with me why wouldn’t it fit. I’m just dipping my toes in the water for reloading, but I’m pretty sure I can load it to fit in the mag.

    Also could you go into detail on the reasons for length and twist. It just seems a little counter intuitive of where my research is leading me if my goal is heavy hitters that are sub .5moa.
     

    DBMJR1

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    Ok bare with me why wouldn’t it fit. I’m just dipping my toes in the water for reloading, but I’m pretty sure I can load it to fit in the mag.

    Also could you go into detail on the reasons for length and twist. It just seems a little counter intuitive of where my research is leading me if my goal is heavy hitters that are sub .5moa.

    Your stated purpose for this rifle is hunting. Why do you feel the need to have a half MOA rifle to hunt with?

    I think you need to sit back, and re-evaluate your standards.



    In the mean time, . . .

    A picture of the elusive Moa.

    moa.jpg
     

    Bangswitch

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    Your stated purpose for this rifle is hunting. Why do you feel the need to have a half MOA rifle to hunt with?

    I think you need to sit back, and re-evaluate your standards.



    In the mean time, . . .

    A picture of the elusive Moa.

    moa.jpg

    Aim small miss small. :rofl:

    My main focus is hunting but I enjoy target shooting too. Most every hunting rifle on the market boasts sub moa from the factory. .5moa from a rifle isn’t that hard to achieve, but from a shooter it’s a different story.

    I’m less caught up on the accuracy as I am bullet weight. I’m an improving shooter and want something I can grow into.

    Also there were quite a few opportunities this past hunting season I wouldn’t even consider between 400-600yards. So it’s not like I’m dreaming of taking long shots when I’m lucky to see past 100 yards. Part of that is me and part the cartridge I’ve been hunting with. If I just opted for a run of the mill bolt gun 1moa at 600yards is 6 inches with that kind of accuracy you are aim at the shoulder and hope you punch both lungs. With .5moa you can aim at the shoulders and hope to punch both shoulders and the lungs. The energy dumped into the two shoulder bones usually drops an animal. Not always the case if a bullet fragments.
     
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    Expert684

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    Buy a Remington 700 SPS L/H 30-06. Then go from there, stocks, barrels, triggers are unlimited for that basic platform. You might get what you want by putting the barreled action into a HS precision stock and hand loads. I bought a Remington PSS in 308 years ago and got 1/2 MOA out of it with hand loads. I still shoot the same gun, it's 22-23 years old. Now it has a Kreiger barrel, Jewel trigger and it shoots under 1/8 MOA. 175 SMK at 2710 FPS. Just depends on what you want?
    I run 200 Bergers Hybrids out of my F T/R gun at 2550, and its a 308.
    If you buy a good platform, you can always improve it as you go. Good luck.
     

    Bangswitch

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    Buy a Remington 700 SPS L/H 30-06. Then go from there, stocks, barrels, triggers are unlimited for that basic platform. You might get what you want by putting the barreled action into a HS precision stock and hand loads. I bought a Remington PSS in 308 years ago and got 1/2 MOA out of it with hand loads. I still shoot the same gun, it's 22-23 years old. Now it has a Kreiger barrel, Jewel trigger and it shoots under 1/8 MOA. 175 SMK at 2710 FPS. Just depends on what you want?
    I run 200 Bergers Hybrids out of my F T/R gun at 2550, and its a 308.
    If you buy a good platform, you can always improve it as you go. Good luck.

    What kind of twist? And do the hybrids begin to wander? Or am I making too much of the twist rate?
     

    DBMJR1

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    Here are my thoughts, for whatever they're worth.

    If the primary purpose for this rifle is hunting, you want a longer pencil profile barrel. You don't hunt sheep and elk from a tree stand with a four wheeler. You carry that rifle on all sorts of terrain with nothing but your leather personnel carriers to help with the load.
    A rifle of this sort can be VERY accurate for the first shot, but POI starts to wander as the barrel heats up. That's not as important for this purpose, as weight.

    If you want a target rifle, you want a short, stubby barrel, with a heavy profile to resist changes in POI. You also want a really wide for-end to ride a rest better. All of this adds weight that makes it an impractical field rifle.

    The GOOD NEWS is that rifles are not like women. You CAN have two rifles at the same time, and they won't get jealous.

    Build two rifles. One for each purpose.

    End enabling.
     

    Expert684

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    They shoot great out of my gun, I have shot them with 1/11 and 1/10 twist barrels. The throat on some factory rifles vary a bit. I have long throats cut in some of my rifles and short throats in others. This is based on the type of bullets I'm going to use in a particular gun. Bullet jump can effect accuracy and velocity. There are people shooting bullets with the ojive well into the lands and more than .100'' out. This is why overall length and magazine length are critical.
    Don't know what you mean by wander? Based on ballistic coefficients and velocity depends on when bullets go subsonic and if they de-stabilize during that transition.
    I would start with a stock gun in a good stock, think of the stock as being the foundation of your house if it is good it will enhance the the improvement you do later. If have a "marginal" stock then the other improvements you do later may not yield the full results.
    Maybe pick a gun and read the reviews on it?
     

    Bangswitch

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    They shoot great out of my gun, I have shot them with 1/11 and 1/10 twist barrels. The throat on some factory rifles vary a bit. I have long throats cut in some of my rifles and short throats in others. This is based on the type of bullets I'm going to use in a particular gun. Bullet jump can effect accuracy and velocity. There are people shooting bullets with the ojive well into the lands and more than .100'' out. This is why overall length and magazine length are critical.
    Don't know what you mean by wander? Based on ballistic coefficients and velocity depends on when bullets go subsonic and if they de-stabilize during that transition.
    I would start with a stock gun in a good stock, think of the stock as being the foundation of your house if it is good it will enhance the the improvement you do later. If have a "marginal" stock then the other improvements you do later may not yield the full results.
    Maybe pick a gun and read the reviews on it?

    Could you unpack your second paragraph a little. I asked because typically the manufacturer of a projectile gives you a twist rate as a guideline. In addition brerger has a calculator using Millers stability formula. Both lead me to believe the really long bullets need 1:10 to stabilize below 2800-2900 fps. Maybe I’m putting too much stock in it, but I must be missing the boat because it sounds like you were shooting matches with 1:11 twist and 200+ grain bullets. If you are bored or want to indulge my thick-headedness here is the calculator I was referencing.
    http://bergerbullets.com/twist-rate-calculator/
     

    Expert684

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    Take a look at Berger .30 cal hunting bullets #30514 uses 1/12 twist and #30515 uses 1/11 twist. This would be the minimum twist you would need. All you have to do is pick a bullet, data for bc and twist rate is on their boxes. Trust me, all you will need is 1/11 or 1/10. If you go heavier than 210 grain you may have to run 1/9 twist. If you want you can P.M. me, i’ll give you my cell. I can break it all down for you.
     

    automan71

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    Also, check out the Remington 700 Lomg Range...30.06, B&C stock, 26* varmint contour barrel. Can be found for mid $600 range. Another would be the Bergara Ridge....has about the same specs just slightly lighter barrel contour.

    I, too, have been considering the ol ‘06 for an all around hunting/paper punching rifle. The problem I have run into is finding one with a threaded from the factory...want to run it with my suppressor.

    Will be following this thread to see what you decide
     

    Bangswitch

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    Also, check out the Remington 700 Lomg Range...30.06, B&C stock, 26* varmint contour barrel. Can be found for mid $600 range. Another would be the Bergara Ridge....has about the same specs just slightly lighter barrel contour.

    I, too, have been considering the ol ‘06 for an all around hunting/paper punching rifle. The problem I have run into is finding one with a threaded from the factory...want to run it with my suppressor.

    Will be following this thread to see what you decide
    If the 700 Long Range comes in southpaw, I can’t seem to find it. Seems no matter what I’m shopping for it’s always of the pink and purple unicorn variety.
     

    HogHunter1203

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    I’ll float this out there. I was in a similar boat 2 years ago. I ended up with a custom 30-06 with the Serengeti chamber. And since im back to strictly bow hunting, I just don’t have use for it any longer. Details of the build below.

    Xtreme Titanium Long Action
    Proof Research Sendero Barrel finished just over 25” and threaded 5/8x24.
    TBAC CB nuzzle brake installed currently
    McMillan Game Hunter stock
    Timney calvin elite trigger
    PTG BDL bottom metal

    The whole gun with the current Leupold VX6 HD scope weighs in just shy of 10#. Aside from range use working up a load, the gun was carried over 60 miles through the desert mountains/hills of central Oregon on an elk hunt. Unfortunately, the elk were scarce...

    I worked up a load with 200 grade ELD-X’s acheiving about 2750 FPS and getting 3.5” groups at 500 yards. I can keep them about .3 MOA inside of 300 yards. The disparity at 500 is simply my shooting ability. Still minute of elk heart though.

    This would be on the high end side of custom builds, but it shoots like a custom should. If you are interested PM or email me and we can speak at greater length about the rifle.
     

    automan71

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    If the 700 Long Range comes in southpaw, I can’t seem to find it. Seems no matter what I’m shopping for it’s always of the pink and purple unicorn variety.

    Roger that...I missed the part about LH, and I don't believe the Rem 700 Long Range comes in LH.
     
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