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  1. #1
    ESSAYONS

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    Feds cut a deal to avoid hurting gun control laws

    I know the link is from CNN but I didn't see any obvious bias other than a warning that says the Feds prevented felons from getting the firearm.

    Short version - Guy sells 80% lowers. A purchase or $25 gets you into his gun club. The guy allows club members to use his equipment; i.e., hot available to the public. You used his machine to complete your 80%. Once it's finished, he helps you build the complete rifle. Guy is arrested for illegal manufacturing firearms.; I don't think he ever had a license.

    At trial, defense argues "under the US Code of Federal Regulations, a firearm frame or receiver is defined as: 'That part of a firearm which provides housing for the hammer, bolt or breechblock, and firing mechanism, and which is usually threaded at its forward portion to receive the barrel.'" AR lower receiver does not fit the legal definition of a receiver so the guy hasn't broken the law. Guy has only allegedly violated a policy "that masquerades as law."

    ATF says there are technical differences but their interpretation captured the intent of the law.

    US District Court Judge "issued a tentative order in which he determined that the ATF had improperly classified the AR-15 lower receivers in" this case. He "added that the combination of the federal law and regulation governing the manufacturing of receivers is 'unconstitutionally vague' as applied in the case against Roh. 'No reasonable person would understand that a part constitutes a receiver where it lacks the components specified in the regulation,' he wrote." He "also found that the ATF's in-house classification process failed to comply with federal rule-making procedures. Changes to substantive federal regulations typically include a notice-and-comment period and eventual publication in the Federal Register."

    The ATF offered a deal. Plead guilty and he would be allowed to change his plea in a year if he hadn't gotten in any more trouble. The case would then be dismissed with the guy spending no time in jail and with nothing about this on his record. It was said the ATF wanted the deal to keep the tentative order from becoming permanent and being used as case law.

    https://www.cnn.com/2019/10/11/us/ar...nvs/index.html

  2. #2
    All or nothing

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    Anybody here remember the little school rock cartoons? ‘I’m Just a Bill’ pretty much spelled out how laws are made. I’m thinking the ATF never watched those cartoons...nor do they understand the hows and whys of law making. That may be the root of their problem. Maybe they’ll get vetoed one day.
    Contrary to popular belief, a head shot is not necessarily a guaranteed kill shot....but it sure does take the fight out of 'em.

    and if one in every 100,000,000 M&M's contained enough cyanide to kill a person, the Mars candy company would be forced by public outcry to correct it———
    Bangswitch

  3. #3
    Take a Card. Any Card.

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    Very interesting.
    “We Sackett boys never killed anything we didn't need to eat unless it was coming at us.”

  4. #4
    Marksman

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    Hmmmmm.

  5. #5
    All or nothing

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    Not sure If NRA or any other pro 2A group backed this guy or not but I’m sure it was a missed opportunity on our part. When I first heard about his arrest I figured they’d have to railroad him to make anything stick considering how he had arranged the process, because he was definitely not producing firearms. The Feds can’t stand anything to do with 3-D printing or finish milling of a lower to produce a firearm and they will go in baring teeth at every opportunity. What’s bad for the guy is win or lose, he loses. Without monetary assistance and a lot of it he will lose everything he has defending himself. The Feds have our money to work with. They can outlast any court case with unlimited resources. Thank goodness for a few real judges left on the bench.
    Contrary to popular belief, a head shot is not necessarily a guaranteed kill shot....but it sure does take the fight out of 'em.

    and if one in every 100,000,000 M&M's contained enough cyanide to kill a person, the Mars candy company would be forced by public outcry to correct it———
    Bangswitch

  6. #6
    Marksman

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    Why would you take that deal? I would of fought them all the way, in the interest of our 2A rights.

    anything to stick it up the ass of the ATF who just make up their own unconstitutional laws when they please..

  7. #7
    Marksman

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    I’m reminded of this story. God forbid we let a free society exercise their freedoms.

    https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/atf-says-solvent-traps-silencers-shuts-sd-tacticals-kit-business/

  8. #8
    Marksman

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    Quote Originally Posted by 981GT4 View Post
    Why would you take that deal? I would of fought them all the way, in the interest of our 2A rights.

    anything to stick it up the ass of the ATF who just make up their own unconstitutional laws when they please..
    it’s easy to say when your money and backside aren’t on the line. We have had to make business decisions like this before when dealing with big corporations the government dwarfs most big companies. When you have seemingly unlimited resources and the deck stack in your favor you don’t have to be in the right.

  9. #9
    All or nothing

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    Quote Originally Posted by 981GT4 View Post
    Why would you take that deal? I would of fought them all the way, in the interest of our 2A rights.

    anything to stick it up the ass of the ATF who just make up their own unconstitutional laws when they please..
    Quote Originally Posted by Bangswitch View Post
    it’s easy to say when your money and backside aren’t on the line. We have had to make business decisions like this before when dealing with big corporations the government dwarfs most big companies. When you have seemingly unlimited resources and the deck stack in your favor you don’t have to be in the right.
    Yeah, I’d like to think I’d fight them all the way...
    There’s a lot to consider when you make that statement. I thought I’d cleared it up.
    Unless you have limitless monetary backing AND a get out of jail free card AND time to burn, no need to keep a job, care less about potentially being labeled a felon, have a sure thing book and movie deal on the table as well as a slam dunk lawsuit planned after your criminal case ends...not to mention how this would affect your family and personal life...
    I just don’t know anyone that can muster that much fight. But props to you if you would!
    Last edited by Magdump; November 5th, 2019 at 08:35 AM.
    Contrary to popular belief, a head shot is not necessarily a guaranteed kill shot....but it sure does take the fight out of 'em.

    and if one in every 100,000,000 M&M's contained enough cyanide to kill a person, the Mars candy company would be forced by public outcry to correct it———
    Bangswitch

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