Buckshot and Turkey Loads the Bottom Line

[Uncle John]

Tight Patterns: To do this you need three things once you figure out what a tight pattern is. You need the proper shell, a tight bored choke and a very clean slick bore. Special forcing cones, and backbored barrels help along with something like the Hastings Wadlock barrel. It would seem that cryogenically treating shotgun barrels is the cutting edge on tight shotgun patterns provided you have the right shell and choke.

Myths

Number 6 shot is better on turkeys. Not on your best day. They lack the energy reqired beyoud 35 yards. #4 plated lead shot and Hevi shot are much better but do not extend past 50 yards. The reason #6 is so popular is because of marksmanship and the fact most turkeys are shot at about 25 yards.

A 3 inch will outshoot a 3 1/2 inch shell turkey load. Not on your best day. It is the difference between throughing a cup of water or a bucket of water. More shot in the shell means more shot on the target.

An open bore shotgun will shoot a tighter pattern with buckshot than a full choke. No way sorry its been proven over and over again to the point I cant even tell where the other stuff came from. But IF the Chief of Police of Bugtussle Louisiana doesnt beleive it, go try it. A .660 turkey choke is even better.

What is the best shotgun shells on the market for tight patterns? That is easy Winchester Supream for off the shelf and Nitro Company Amunition for custom loads which is the best in the world. That goes for turkey and buckshot loads. Hornady has come up with some good police buckshot loads but hunters will have to wait, unless all your going to shoot is coyotes.

If you want to hit something beyound 25 yards use a scope or red dot. Most people havent the slightest idea where their shotgun is patterning so it comes down to hit or miss. A scope will zero you right in the center of the pattern.

A shotgun pattern travels in a string not like a wall of shot...now you know that too.

Full choke is .700 in a regular 12 ga shotgun like a Remington 870. Full choke is .710 in a back bored shotgun like a Mossberg 835. The tightest regular choke that I have seen is a .640 in a Hastings. Turkey chokes are best in .665to .650 and require some personal testing.

Nitro Company says .660 is best for buckshot.

What is a good pattern? A long range shotgun pattern should be small and not scattered, a turkey gun pattern should be about the size of the palm of your hand and fingers at 40 yards. While an Imp Cyl. pattern would be wide but with out gaps. More open chokes mean less effect range and wider patterns with any shot size.

A good standard for 00 buckshot patterning is when you can no longer keep 3pellets on a paper plate you have reached your max range for that gun. This is good for both combat and hunting. It will vary greatly with the gun and choke.

Most police shotguns are cly. bore and go for a scatter effect with buckshot. A hunting shotgun needs a tight choke for long range effect on deer hunting.

Max range for a turkey gun with 3.5 inch premium shell is 50 yards, with the average being 35 yards.

Max range for riot shotguns about 25 yards give or take the fact someone actully knows what they are doing.

Max range with buckshot in the hunting arena is 60 yards give or take that someone knows what they are doing.

How to estimate range on a moving deer. Simple, if you can clearly see the deer's eye it is in buckshot range.

That should help, its all been tested and proven so if you just have to argue with a brick wall go right ahead.

 

[Nail Gun]

Never been a fan of buckshot. Lost a buck from 15yrds broadside with OOO 12GA 3" mags. It was a clean shot but it ended up swimming the river after 3 hrs of trackiing. Oddly enough I arrived in time to see it climbing the opposite bank. Didn't have a boat and I'm not a strong swimmer. I elected to try to finish it off rather than let a wounded animal go. I emptied the gun, my third and final shot must have hit the spine. He dropped, rolled down the bank into the river and promptly sank. Never used buckshot again.

However, I often use #4 turkey 3.5" lead super mags with an x-full tube on hogs. They are highly effective. I once took a 200lb hog with a single broadside shot @ 40 yards. He dropped immediately. As stated above, shotguns on big game require testing and a hunter that knows their eccentricities and limitations.

 

[Uncle John]

Thats pretty interesting about the buckshot deer at 15 yards. I have killed about 50 deer with buckshot and I never had that happen. I have shot deer at 15 yards with 000 and it was a trainwreck same with 00 and number 1 buck. The guns I used are a Remington 1100 2 3/4 inch with #1 buck full choke, CZ Combination gun 3 inch 000 Imp mod choke, Remington 870 3.5 inch 00 buck Strangler choke, and an AYA Double 10 ga 3.5 inch 00 Buck full chokes.

The 1100 once shot right through a yopine bush and then shot right through a running deer on the other side. All 16 #1 buck hit and some went all the way through the deer, DRT.

I killed a buck DRT with the 10 ga at 70 yards and got 7 hits in the kill zone.
I destroyed a 9 point at 25 yards with the Super mag with all 18 pellets hitting the shoulder you can see what it did in the article Buckshot the Hunter's www.foremosthunting.com

A straight down shot at about 15 yards went through a pine bough with 000 buck and killed the buck undernieth the tree with 7 out of 10 kill hits.

I have missed completly so dont think you can't and I have had some marginal shots that still killed.

I have killed 5 deer with only one buckshot pellet from #4 buck to 000.

I made two amazing shots that made me wonder....a running doe was hit with four 000 in the neck, shoulder and two through the lungs at 90 yards with the CZ. Then I fired twice on a really small doe with the 10 ga, thats 36 00 buck going down range and one hit the deer right in the heart, it went 50 yards and I found the buckshot pellet just under the hide on the oppisite side, Luck Shot not recommended.

Now at 15 yards Pro African hunters stop lion charges with buckshot.

This is what I think about your 15 yard shot, because it happen to me. You shot high in all the excitment and only scored a marginal or fringe hit. In my case Bambi ran up behind me while I was sitting on the ground and all most kissed me. I turned and shot at the deer's ass. I hit it with one #1 pellet right in the back of the head. The other 15 pellets went high. Improved cly choke that I should have known better.

Now since you got the deer and skinned it Id like to know what that first shot did, what kind of shell was it and what the choke was.

 

[Nail Gun]

That illustrates my point exactly. I know full well it was a fluke shot and not likely to happen again. Buckshot would not still be used and considered a viable round if my experience was common. However, I obviously didn't know my weapon's setup and round well enough, so I shouldn't have used it.

Unfortunately I lost the buck since it sank in the river. It was 15 years ago so I don't remember all of the details. I elected to take the scattergun that day because I used to shoot competitive skeet in VA, so I was very comfortable with a shotgun. I was using an 1187 Premier, 28" barrel, I think with a modified choke. I think the rounds were Federals, I remember they were chilled shot and buffered. The deer came around a corner and froze when he saw me. I raised the bead, steadied it behind the shoulder and squeezed. He was not moving when I fired. I'm not sure if it was the force of the impact or the shock of the report but he flipped in the air and landed on his back before taking off. I remember seeing 4 distinct wounds appear around his shoulder.

My final shots at him across the river may have been around 70 yards. Based on the pellet strikes on the water and bank I would guess it was giving a 10' pattern at that range. Therefore it was also a fluke my final shot did the trick.

Since then I've picked up an 870 super mag. That's what I use with the 3.5" turkey mags on hogs. Unlike the buck incident I have supreme confidence in that setup. If I used buckshot today I'd use 3.5" mags and a turkey tube. I have patterned 3.5" OOO rounds with a turkey tube. Oher than dislocating my shoulder I was impressed with the results.

 

[Uncle John]

The super mag with a Remington Ventilator choke and Nitro Amunition company lead #4s is an awsome turkey combo. When I deer hunt with it I change to a Strangler choke and 3.5 inch Winchester 00 buck. My gun has a cantiliver mount and a Bushnell turkey scope as well but it requires a re zero when shooting buckshot as it will pattern lower than the turkey loads. A zero of 25 yards is good to go with a scope and buck or turkey loads. Much easier to adjust your pattern center.

 

[highstandard40]

Very informative article John and I agree with your findings based on my experience. I have done quite a bit of shotgun load testing myself. I was using buffered shotshells long before they were available for sale by the ammo manufacturers. Based on some articles published at that time, and using components from "Ballistic Products" I assembled loads capable of 90-95% patterns at 40 yards with Full choked 12ga shotguns using # 4 and # 6 shot. I have killed deer with a shotgun but have chosen to abandon any further efforts based on a test I did, again, many years ago. The statement you made of a three pellet strike inside a paper plate determining your effective range is very sound advice indeed. My test revealed what I felt was yet another factor to consider, again based on what was available at that time (longer ago than I care to admit). My test was based not only on pellet strikes inside a 12" circle but also individual pellet energy and penetration. The loads I tested were both 2 3/4" and 3" 12ga in pellet sizes from 00 down to #4 buckshot. My test medium was 1/2" thick pine plywood placed at 40 yards. My logic was if the pellets could not penetrate 1/2" of pine, I could not expect those pellets to sufficiently penetrate a deer and break bone if needed. My results were that even with 00 buck at that range, only 60% of the pellets would pass through the plywood. The rest would not. My fear was that my luck would be that the only pellets I would hit a deer with would be the ones not capable of penetrating. I assumed this failure was caused by deformed pellets losing their velocity. Now before I get flamed here, please realize that this was in fact 25+ years ago and ammunition technology has changed quite a bit since then. I'm hopeful that shotgun loads are much improved now. And I know that many a freezer has been filled with venison compliments of a shotgun equipped hunter. I also know I've heard a painfully large number of stories that went something like.... "I found hair and blood but that ole 8 point gave me the slip. I know I hit him hard though". I now hunt only with a rifle or handgun (XP100 or Contender) and will save my shotgun for birds only. Again, I know currently available ammo is improved, but i'll stick with my rifle. I feel I can control the outcome a little better. Just my 2 cents. YMMV

 

[Nail Gun]

Ok. Just checked what I have currently. I have Win Super-X 3.5" OO rounds with 18 pellets. I have a two-dot Rem branded x full tube, a three-dot Rem x full tube that is ported all the way around and a Hastings .665 dia tube. Would any of those tubes make a good combo with the rounds I have? Is it possible to have too much restriction with buckshot?

 

[Uncle John]

Id say your a lot more qualified than most to offer an opinion on buckshot because you took them out and tested them. Others have tried pine as a test medium including Strangler chokes who claim more penatration with their chokes, I think not until I see it in balistic gelitin. I know that one 00 buck will kill a deer at 100 yards but Ill never try that shot again. Hanging on the wall over me is a turkey I killed with one #4 pellet and Ill never try that again either at 70 yards but it can be done.

Several years ago myself and a guy from bell hellicopter came up with a shotgun shell that will kill a turkey at 90 yards but until someone comes up with the money it stays put. It is called the Behive round.

We now have Hevi-Shot buck shot or heavier than lead that has more energy, it works but there is a factor few know about and that is the sound barrier.

If you can keep a shot pattern above the speed of sound it will remain on path but when it slows down it passes through the vibroto of the sound barrier again and this causes each pellet to flare like a knucle ball as they have no spin to stablize them. This is what happens to shot in the end of its trajectory.

You also have to contend with the element of Deminishing Returns as you cant get enough of a certain kind of shot in a shell to score enough lethal hits. So around 40 yards is about it for turkey and around 65 for magnum buckshot.

 

[Uncle John]

Ok. Just checked what I have currently. I have Win Super-X 3.5" OO rounds with 18 pellets. I have a two-dot Rem branded x full tube, a three-dot Rem x full tube that is ported all the way around and a Hastings .665 dia tube. Would any of those tubes make a good combo with the rounds I have? Is it possible to have too much restriction with buckshot?

Try them all at 25 yards and see which one shoots the tightest pattern .660 is good and yes you can get too tight but it depends on the gun. We did a Mossberg 835 which is a back bored gun and it liked the .690 for buckshot with .710 being the standard full choke for a back bore.

My Steven 411 really likes 000 in a .660 Carlson so you just have to check.

Make sure your chokes are well lubed .....

 

[hunter5567]

I use Dixie buckshot. It has 3-.60 round balls that weigh 315 grs each. They will stay in a 12" circle at 40 yards and a tighter turkey choke will get them down to a 7" circle.
You can find them online and order direct. Its a small company so you have to send a check or money order. Look up Dixie slugs online.

 

[scubasteve]

Let me go get my hip boots on..................

 

[Uncle John]

That Tri Ball buckshot is everything they say it is. I went over and got to know the boss. they know what they are doing and their test results are awsome as well as a little grusome, Tri Ball is effective

 

[hunter5567]

I was shooting at 50 yards and all 3 balls were in a 12" circle with a regular full choke.
Regular buckshot won't hold a candle to this stuff. Each ball has around 6-700 ft lbs of energy at that range.

 

[RMc]

You may want to try:

I was shooting at 50 yards and all 3 balls were in a 12" circle with a regular full choke.
Regular buckshot won't hold a candle to this stuff. Each ball has around 6-700 ft lbs of energy at that range.

If you are shooting a short "funnel" choke tube, you may want to try an extended full to x-full choke with an extended parallel section. In my experience, Tri-Ball patterns most consistently with extended parallel section choke tubes.