Louisiana Expungements do not allow firearm ownership according to NICS/FBI/DOJ

[coance]

You would think but it isn't so. I actually was given a CHP and then had it revoked after the Feds told me that the state should have never issued it.

 

[hjlebert]

I would call the Louisiana Attorney General and ask their opinion on the matter. The State Police may be enforcing the law incorrectly, it happens due ti intreptation. Let me know.

 

[coance]

State police have said that the only pardon that counts is a gubernatorial pardon when it comes to a ccw

 

[Gungrabishere14]

I could care less about the ccw but when the feds use it as an excuse to take away the rights that they and the state restored followed by several years later when nothing has has changed based on a 17 yr old court case then yes i think its a raw deal. All these calls have been made and they are not gonna rock their political ambitions for a few people who call and complain that they received letters from the feds stating the gun rights we agreed you legally had under state and federal had are no longer valid under federal law but the state says the opposite, sorry but why dont you pick up the phone an call, there are only 2 other people i know fighting for their rights trying to change this injustice. If more people would grow a pair and contact their reps, atty general then maybe they would get off there lazy butts and do something, make statement to if not to make people aware that they may be in violation as common courtesy. And the letters they sent to the FFL's was even more vague and pathetic as to the justification of their regular customers getting denied due to recent developments. Its in the thread somewhere.

 

[DAVE_M]

Which is why I advocate a pathway for a non-violent ex-con to regain their Constitutional Rights! All of them!

A conviction of a non-violent felony! Like skinning the bear in Kentucky or wherever?!?

Child pornography is non-violent? Or is it? Who decides what is violent and non-violent?

And it was Alabama stating it's a felony charge to train your bear to wrestle

Even though you aren't being violent in that crime, the bear technically is, so is it a violent felony? If it is, that seems like it would be an unbearable burden

 

[Gungrabishere14]

Louisiana Law pertaining to: LRS 14:95.1

POSSESSION of firearm (or)

CARRYING concealed weapon

By person convicted of certain felonies-



This law prohibits the POSSESSION of a firearm or concealing a weapon defined as:

Pistol, revolver, rifle, shotgun, machine gun, submachine gun, black

Powder weapon or assault rifle which is designed to fire or is capable

Of firing fixed cartridge ammunition or from which a shot or projectile

Is discharged by an explosion



The *certain felony* laws list as being:

1- Solicitation for murder 29- Illegal use of weapons or dangerous

2- First degree murder instrumentalities

3- Second degree murder 30- Terrorism

4- Manslaughter 31- Aggravated second degree battery

5- Aggravated battery 32- Aggravated assault on peace officer

6- Second degree battery with firearm

7- Aggravated assault 33- Aggravated assault with firearm

8- Mingling harmful substances 34- Armed robbery- use of firearm

9- Aggravated rape 35- Second degree robbery

10- Forcible rape 36- Disarming a peace officer

11- Simple rape 37- Stalking

12- Sexual battery 38- Second degree cruelty to juveniles

13- Second degree sexual battery 39- Aggravated flight from an officer

14- Intentional exposure to AIDS virus 40- Aggravated incest – Repealed in 2014

15- Aggravated kidnapping 41- Battery of a police officer

16- Second degree kidnapping 42- Trafficking of children for sexual

17- Simple kidnapping purposes

18- Aggravated arson 43- Human trafficking

19- Aggravated criminal damage to property 44- Home invasion

20- Aggravated burglary (Cont…..)

21- Armed robbery

22- First degree robbery

23- Simple robbery

24- Purse snatching

25- Extortion

26- Assault by drive-by shooting

27- Aggravated crime against nature

28- Carjacking







In addition to the *crimes of violence* laws listed, the certain felonies continue as being:

45- Simple burglary

46- Burglary of a Pharmacy

47- Burglary of an inhabited dwelling

48- Unauthorized entry into an inhabited dwelling

49- Felony illegal use of weapons or dangerous instrumentalities

50- Manufacture or possession of a delayed action incendiary device

51- Manufacture or possession of a bomb

52- Possession of a firearm while in the possession of or

During the sale or distribution of a controlled dangerous substance

53- Any violation of the Uniform Controlled Dangerous Substance Law which is a FELONY

53- Any crime which is defined as an ATTEMPT to commit any one of the above-enumerated

Offenses under the laws of this state (LA), or who has been convicted under the laws of

Of any other state or of the United States or of any foreign government or country of a

Crime which, if committed in this state, would be one of the above enumerated crimes

55- Any sex offense defined under Louisiana Revised statute 15:541 or out of state equivalent

56- Domestic abuse aggravated assault

57- Vehicular homicide with blood alcohol content exceeding .20g%

58- Any conviction under the domestic abuse battery law per LRS 14:95.10



This law prohibits the possession of a firearm of any person convicted (or guilty plea) of any of these

Listed crimes or attempt to commit these crimes and a person found guilty of violating this law

Shall be imprisoned at hard labor for not less than ten nor more than twenty years without

Benefit of probation, parole or suspension of sentence.



This law shall not apply to any person who has not been convicted of ANY FELONY for a period of TEN YEARS from the date of completion of sentence, probation, parole, or suspension of sentence.



If a person is under an active restraining or protective order, you are prohibited from possessing a firearm.



If a person is on probation or parole for ANY felony offense, the assigned probation officer will inform you of your right to a firearm based on their criteria.



POSSESSION Defined under LRS 14:222.2 (A)7- Means to have physical possession of or otherwise to exercise dominion or control over tangible property



LRS 14:95.1.1 and 14:95.1.2 Prohibits the supplying of a person convicted of the *certain felonies* with

A firearm or ammunition with person found to be guilty of violating these laws facing up to five years imprisonment.

Reference: Louisiana Revised Statutes of 2011

Statutory Criminal Law and Procedure

Acts of the 2010 Regular Session of the Legislat

 

[Gungrabishere14]

Dave hopefully this clarifys what is a violent felony is in louisiana, and notice it includes the following statement which contridicts ccw law even thought 14.95.1 says possesion of a firearm by a felon and carrying a concealed weapon.
This law shall not apply to any person who has not been convicted of ANY FELONY for a period of TEN YEARS from the date of completion of sentence, probation, parole, or suspension of sentence.

 

[323MAR]

Just for my own interest, does anyone definitively know what the, least egregious, least offense, and least violent "felony" conviction that the US has?

Selling single cigarettes or serving a Big Gulp in New York?
Bloomberg would take your guns for a lot less!

 

[323MAR]

http://www.akbizmag.com/Alaska-Busi...toration-Bill-Signed-Into-Law-Ramrass-HB-408/

http://housemajority.org/spon.php?id=26hb408

These show how Alaska fixed it.

That actually makes sense. Felons who did not harm anyone should have a right to protect themselves. Violent felons are the real threat.

 

[madwabbit]

The Fed now says that if you are ineligible for CCW then you are ineligible to buy a firearm through NICS.

I hear that often, but I've yet to see it in case law or current legal verbiage from a notable source. The only felon that I know personally had his rights restored years ago- and has purchased firearms right beside me.

Presuming this is true, how would this apply to Arizona, Wyoming, Alaska, Kansas, Arkansas, or Vermont? (constitutional carry states) Seems like an awful big oversight, even for the fed.

 

[Vermiform]

I hear that often, but I've yet to see it in case law or current legal verbiage from a notable source. The only felon that I know personally had his rights restored years ago- and has purchased firearms right beside me.

Presuming this is true, how would this apply to Arizona, Wyoming, Alaska, Kansas, Arkansas, or Vermont? (constitutional carry states) Seems like an awful big oversight, even for the fed.

Got me. I've only seen the folks posting up in this thread saying it happened to them. FWIW, I believe them. Too lazy/busy/tired/sleepy to verify it though........

 

[charlie12]

Hell I'm slow at learning about all this stuff. Man after about 19 years of having a La. CHP I'm still calling it a CHP and not all those other letters people call it.

 

[coance]

Rabbit have you seen him do it recently? As far as the other states as long as the state does not restrict firearm possession in any way the Fed doesn't either. If you go to the links I put above on Alaska you will see that since the went constitutional carry it made solved the problem there.

 

[DAVE_M]

Yes, Constitutional Carry does fix a lot of BS that we have to go through.

Hell I'm slow at learning about all this stuff. Man after about 19 years of having a La. CHP I'm still calling it a CHP and not all those other letters people call it.

+1

I often see CCW & CCH, sometimes CWL, CHL, & CWP. I rarely see people actually call it a CHP.

 

[madwabbit]

Rabbit have you seen him do it recently? As far as the other states as long as the state does not restrict firearm possession in any way the Fed doesn't either. If you go to the links I put above on Alaska you will see that since the went constitutional carry it made solved the problem there.

He bought a S&W when I bought my 2nd G19, and I was debating on a G43 ...so however recent that was. 3-4 mos maybe?

 

[coance]

He may be just slipping by somehow. As I said if you send me a email add. I will send a pic of the papers I received from the DOJ stating that LARS 40:1379.3 (c)(10) is the reason that I now cannot possess a firearm. I have not even had anything worse than a speeding ticket since 1995. I had my rights restored in 1997 by way of first offender pardon. I had a UPIN from the ATF. Up until last year everything went well. Then last year I was denied on a firearms nics check and after filing a appeal my UPIN info was all sent back to me with a letter saying that since LA law would not allow me to have a CHP that the Fed would no longer allow me to have any firearms.
As far as the person you know ,they may want to do some digging because if they are in the same boat as many of us then he is in violation of federal law.

 

[madwabbit]

He may be just slipping by somehow. As I said if you send me a email add. I will send a pic of the papers I received from the DOJ stating that LARS 40:1379.3 (c)(10) is the reason that I now cannot possess a firearm. I have not even had anything worse than a speeding ticket since 1995. I had my rights restored in 1997 by way of first offender pardon. I had a UPIN from the ATF. Up until last year everything went well. Then last year I was denied on a firearms nics check and after filing a appeal my UPIN info was all sent back to me with a letter saying that since LA law would not allow me to have a CHP that the Fed would no longer allow me to have any firearms.
As far as the person you know ,they may want to do some digging because if they are in the same boat as many of us then he is in violation of federal law.

so when you applied to the atf for a firearms reinstatement, what were you told?

So to clarify: Fed says "on paper" you have rights restored. Louisiana says you have rights restored. Louisiana says you are, however, ineligible for a chp. Fed says since ineligible for chp, ineligible for nics restoration? Is that about the jist of it?


*Automatic* first-offender pardon:

Both the Louisiana Constitution of 1974 and the state’s criminal code recognize a second type of pardon for some convicted felons - the so-called
*automatic* first-offender pardon. The second sentence of Article 4, Section 5(E)(1) of the constitution states that a *first offender convicted of a non-violent crime, or convicted of aggravated battery, second degree
battery, aggravated assault, mingling harmful substances, aggravated criminal damage to property, purse snatching, extortion or illegal use of weapons or dangerous instrumentalities never previously convicted of a felony shall be pardoned automatically upon completion of his sentence, without a recommendation of the Board of Pardons and without action by the governor.*

The statutory equivalent of this provision is La. R.S. 15:572(B), which states that *a first offender never previously convicted of a felony shall be pardoned automatically upon
completion of his sentence without a recommendation of the Board of Pardons and without action by the governor.*

In this instance, *first offender* is defined in 15:572 (c) as meaning anyone convicted in Louisiana of a felony, *but never previously convicted of a felony within this state or convicted
under the laws of any other state or of the United States or of any foreign government or country of a crime which, if committed in this state, would have been a felony, regardless of any previous
conviction for any misdemeanors.*

This type of pardon has been recognized by Louisiana courts as restoring the basic rights of citizenship discussed in Art. 1, Sec. 20 of the state constitution. These include the right to
vote, the right to work, the right to hold public office, and the right to possess firearms (subject, of course, to 14:95.1 restrictions). However, the *automatic* type of pardon does not restore the
status of innocence conferred by a gubernatorial pardon. State v. Adams, 355 So. 2d 917, n3
922 (1978).

There are several considerations that go along with this type of pardon. Besides restoring just the rights (and not the privileges) of citizenship, it is also a one-time-only affair. La. R.S.
15:572(D). In addition, this type of pardon does not wipe the slate clean, as would a gubernatorial pardon; the status of *innocence,* thus, is not restored. State v. Adams, 355 So.2d 917, n3 922

Copied from published material via James Boren, criminal defense attorney in baton rouge.

 

[hjlebert]

That is all true but non-violent felons are still being denied because the Louisiana CHP laws restrict CHP's according to:

40:1379.3(c)(10) Not have been convicted of, have entered a plea of guilty or nolo contendere to, or not be charged under indictment or a bill of information for any crime of violence or any crime punishable by imprisonment for a term of one year or greater. A conviction, plea of guilty, or plea of nolo contendere under this Paragraph shall include an expungement of such conviction or a dismissal and conviction set-aside under the provisions of Code of Criminal Procedure Article 893. However, a person who has been convicted of a violation of 18 U.S.C. 491(a) shall be permitted to qualify for a concealed handgun permit if fifteen or more years has elapsed between the date of application and the successful completion or service of any sentence, deferred adjudication, or period of probation or parole.

It does list things that will not erase a conviction under this law but "Pardon" in any fashion is not one of them. So how are the State Police refusing to issue a CHP based on an interpetation on a law that is very specific? That is the real question. If this was reversed it would allow felons with a First Offender Pardon buy guns again because the restriction would be nonexistent. The law isn't the only thing that could faciliate/change but the interpetation of the current law would fix the problem. I already have a call into the Louisiana Attorney General and my State Rep. to inform them of this error or to find out if there is a case to back the interpetation.

 

[Emperor]

You guys that are in this situation (that of which this thread is about), need to legally apply for CHP, or try to legally purchase a firearm, get denied, and then file suit.

Think about this: The IRS was willfully refusing to turn over documents concerning the Lois Lerner crime; was hiding documents, erasing emails, God knows what else, and the only way they were forced to comply (with federal law by the way), was through a FOIA lawsuit? Look at Clinton's e-mail crap? She's already broken federal law, and they are looking for ways to sweep that under the rug.

Do you think for one second, that your dilemmas matter to the feds or the LSP? You guys can lay out your cases all you want here, but other than a semi-interesting 17 page thread that is now going in circles, you are wasting your time on this forum. There is no one here that can help you get your guns back.

Sorry! That's the way I see it.

 

[coance]

Rabbit 99% accurate first offender pardon or not I have still easily met the 10 year cleanse of 14:95.1

Emperor I understand that fully. I am not just arguing this on a Internet forum. I have been in contact with several people and am working on some things with a few of them.

The main reason I still post in this thread is to help people understand what is going on. There are alot of people that are just finding out that they have lost their rights. I also hope that the more people this reaches the more people will contact their local reps and try to straighten it out.

As far as far as filing suit. There has been some talk with a few of us on doing this. Like most things biggest problem is money.