Need suggestions turning 21

[Crimson]

I will finally be 21 in december and I have been saving the cash to sbr and suppress one of my ar-15's and I am looking into .45 pistol to suppress aswell. My question is would it be better to start a trust or llc, what's the benefit or disadvantage of both. Which easier to add family members too later down the road. Which one would allow me to keep the firearm at different addresses if necessary. I work out of town a lot so I would want to store in a family members safe when im not there. I assume that person would have to be on the trust/llc. Are wait times any shorter for either one. Would I be wasting my time with the current uncertainty of atf's future. How often do they come to inspect what you have. Would I be setting myself up for all my guns to be taken if they really do ban them for good. Any advise would be very helpful I have read alot but most of it doesn't make sense what's the difference in form 1,2,3,4 I just don't really understand it and I don't have a dealer nearby to get advise. What would happen if I was out of town when they wanted to inspect my collection. Would leaving them at my house under my roommates control be illegal even though its my address. How hard is it to do a change of address when I move into my own place. Would the change of address need to be finalized before I moved. I just know there's a fine line to walk with Nfa firearms and I don't want to mess up.

 

[noob]

a Trust works for me. I have my brother on it as a Trustee so he can possess anything on my Schedule A.

Form 1 - Manufacture a firearm - Tax Paid
Form 2 - Register a firearm (used so that some manufacturer's can convert a "normal" lower to a registered SBR lower) - Tax Exempt (you still have to get it transferred to you on a Form 4 and pay a $200 tax)
Form 3 - Transfer among dealers - Tax Exempt
Form 4 - Transfer to individual - Tax Paid
Form 5 - Transfer firearm - Tax Exempt (i believe this is typically used to transfer a Title II firearm to family members)

i have never heard of an instance where the ATF knocked on someone's door b/c they possessed Title II firearms for all legal purposes.

If your birthday is in December, you may want to wait till SHOT Show in January, that's when a lot of manufacturers like to show what's coming out. Problem is, we don't know WHEN it'll come out. But AAC had a picture on their Facebook yesterday of a "eccentric" style can, similar to the Osprey. it was just the tube, but we can begin to get ideas.

 

[cajun 22]

A lot of questions. I'll try to help some. I went with a trust for a couple of reasons, no cleo sighoff, no passport photos, no fingerprints to send in, can add others to it as trustees, a family member is listed to aquire my things in the event of my passing, trust is a onetime expense and never has to be renewed. I don't know about the LLC so I will not comment on that but others have been happy with this route. You are allowed to only list one address on the forms and that is where the items must reside. Only people listed on the trust should have access to the items. Make sure these are people you really trust. You can store your items at your parent's home if that make's you feel more secure with traveling as much as you say you do, as long as that is the address you use on the forms. It is legal to leave your items there as long as no one, not on the trust, has access to the items ( not sharing the safe combo ). When you move you just fill out a change of address form and you are done. Just keep a copy of the form as they will not send you new forms. Send it with a signature receipt required so you have proof they received it. I've been doing this for about 4 years now and have never heard of an inspection of your items and have never been asked for my papers when I use the items. I say get your items as soon as you can in the event that more restrictions are put in place. The only forms you will have to deal with are the form 1 for registering your SBR and form 4 for transferring items from others to you. Don't forget about the State Police forms also. We are one of the few states that require this process for NFA items but we are not restricted to what items we can have. I am sure there is a dealer in your area as I remember a post on the matter.
Good Luck and hope this helps.

 

[Crimson]

If I put the address of the trust at my parents house instead of mine, would it be legal for the firearms to be at my house overnight since I am there with them? If I were to leave my house and I had the address as my parents house, would I have to take the firearms with me when I left my house. Basically if I put the address on the trust as my parents house so I could leave them there when im out of town could I keep them at my house when im back in town? I work out of town usually 2-3months at a time, that's why I don't like leaving anything unattended. Does the trust address have to be the same that's on drivers license.

 

[trey504]

Mg's have to sleep at the address on the form 4. I'm pretty sure its the same for sbrs and suppressors.

 

[Crimson]

Would it be legal to even have them overnight at the hunting camp, suppresprs for night hog hunts for example.

 

[cajun 22]

As long as they are in your possession and you have your paperwork, you are ok. I bring suppressors to my hunting camp all the time. As long as it is legal to have the items where you are, you are ok. Now, sbr's and mg's require travel forms if you cross state lines but suppressors do not. I went hunting in Colorado last year with my .308 can and it was not a problem. I hunt with suppressors in MS and never had a problem. As long as the items are in your control and no one else has access to them they could spend the night at your house if you plan on shooting the next day. I would not push it past that. A second safe at this location would be the best thing to have in case something goes down. I am not a lawyer and these are only my personal experiences over the past few years. It would be best to talk to an attorney when setting up your trust, if you go that route, and he could answer those questions better.

 

[Crimson]

That makes sense but then if it was an issue could I just say I brought them here yesterday I was planning on going shooting today? Nfa seems like a big pain in the ass... I'm almost considering holding off until I get my own place.

 

[cajun 22]

I would not wait. The approval times are getting longer. Just list your parent's address on the forms, buy a safe, and leave them there. It's sounds more like a PITA than it really is. When you get your own place just send in the change of address forms and your are done. The trust is just a notary stamp away from any change you have to make.

 

[Crimson]

If I were to keep just the receiver of a sbr in the safe would it be legal to leave at my house when just my roommate is there if I put my address as my house. I wouldn't mind buying just another small safe. Would my parents need to be on the trust if I leave the weapons at their house like I have previously discussed since that's not the address on my liscense

 

[Pale Horse]

Dude. Slow down.

Now, go by Diamond Gun on Desiard St. out by Ray's Pege. They're a classIII dealer and can walk you through it.

 

[Crimson]

I just have a lot of questions. And a few bad experiences at diamond the owners wife is the only one there that shows any customer service. But I didn't know they were class III they never have anything there. Besides I thought that was what this forum was for giving and receiving advise. I feel everything I have asked are legitiment concerns and just hoped for some help from fellow bs members. Which so far I have gotten some decent advise. Honestly I wouldn't feel comfortable going in diamond and asking these questions I never feel welcome there.

 

[cajun 22]

If I were to keep just the receiver of a sbr in the safe would it be legal to leave at my house when just my roommate is there if I put my address as my house. I wouldn't mind buying just another small safe. Would my parents need to be on the trust if I leave the weapons at their house like I have previously discussed since that's not the address on my liscense

It should always be "LEFT" at the address on the forms when you are not around. Your parents do not need to be listed on the trust if you leave it at their house. They just cannot have the combo to the safe or the keys to your lockbox (no access). Also as long as your roomate does not have "access" to the goods, you are ok. I know it seems like a lot of BS to go through but once you start, and nobody's cares, you will be able sleep at night and enjoy your stuff.

 

[Crimson]

Thanks cajun 22 you have been very helpful!! One more question depending on who is on the trust how do you prove individual ownership. I completely trust everyone I would consider puting on it. But in the case of a fight with someone else and they get mad and decide to sell an item. How would you prove who's it really is? I'm going to use my address to keep it simple. My only concern was my roommate getting in trouble for me leaving the weapons there unattended. As I am not sure if he would want to be on the trust. Most likely I think he would not. My dad would be on the trust, just in case something happened to me he could easily take possession of the firearms.

 

[cajun 22]

My personal opinion is to only have family members on the trust. You would be listed as the Grantor which is who is in charge. Do not put anyone you will ever get in a fight with. Friends can pick up and go but it's kind of hard to get rid of your family. As far as someone selling an item that can not happen because you are the grantor. Anyone wanting to play with the items should carry a copy of the trust that shows them as a trustee.

 

[Crimson]

I agree with that but I don't trust half my family. My cousin stole my dads ak-47. I have one or two close friends I would consider adding if they want to be.

 

[Crimson]

One more question what are the engraving laws for a trust do sbr abs and suppressors all need to be engraved what needs to be engraved on them.

 

[Takuan]

If I were just turning 21, all I can say is I sure wouldn't be thinking about suppressors!

 

[Crimson]

Oh I've got other things planned, but sbr's and suppressors are just so much more badass. And guns retain there value alot better than the other ways I would spend my money. Not to mention if they decide to make sbr's and suppressors illegal for civilian production I just got the down payment for a house an initial $5000 investment turning into $50,000 yeah I can live with that. And if not oh well I've got some awesome toys.

 

[mikewxs]

You're right about Diamond. I went thruogh them for my last suppressor, not a very good experience. They misplaced or didn't send in the State approval, of course they blamed it on the State. Took an extra 4 months to get my Form 4 back. Anyway by the time you're 21 I'll have my CL III SOT. got tired of paying the tax and transfer fees, and I have a couple distributorships lined up and can show you some options and help you with the purchase and transfer. It's a quick drive to Ball from Monroe. If you are going to purchase more than one NFA item the Trust is the way to go, so get that done first. PM inbound