New threat from North Korea

[Bayoupiper]

Ok, that was kind of in jest.


But I'll bet on this country and all the armed Americans that would resist such an invasion.


They just need to hurry up and do it before Obama takes all our guns away from us!


.

 

[flamatrix99]

Yeah, I don't think we're in danger of being occupied by Kim Jong Il. I do think he's a loose cannon with a nuclear cannonball. Like someone said earlier, this is not going to end well.....If he pulls something really stupid instead of simply running his mouth, the end result will be a lot of dead Koreans- probably North & South.

He is like a spoiled kid.. He is screaming, "Pay attention to me, I am important!" Ignoring all this stupid stuff is just pissing them off more and more. All these missile tests and popping off nukes are just his was of upping the anti to get the world's and mostly the US's attention.

 

[JadeRaven]

Well when every able-bodied male is either in the active or reserve military, of course they have one of the largest standing armies in the world.

I believe prior to the Gulf War, Iraq had the *third* largest army in the world. And that wasn't even a fight worth mentioning.

South Korea alone could handle North Korea in any sort of military campaign. Their population (and population fit for military service) is double that of the north's. Their GDP to support any sort of war is not even comparable to the other's. Life expectancy in South Korea = 78 years. Life expectancy in North Korea = 64 years. Distance between the two = a few hundred yards.

The only reason the Democratic People's Republic wasn't completely obliterated in the 50's was because UN forces pushed into China and the Chinese got pissed off.

Could Kim launch a missile or two at our soil? Sure. Could we face a seaborne or airborne attack on US soil? Not a chance in hell. One US carrier group could repulse the entirety of the North Korean "navy" and "air force."

 

[LongRange]

Ok, that was kind of in jest.


But I'll bet on this country and all the armed Americans that would resist such an invasion.


They just need to hurry up and do it before Obama takes all our guns away from us!


.

BINGO! WE HAVE A WINNER!!
WHAT PRIZE DO WE HAVE FOR HIM BOB?
A BRAND NEW GUN!!!

 

[DR.NUMBERS]

Gee you watch too much CNN ... real facts..

I don't watch any CNN.

GJ, quoting Wikipedia.

North Korea is the most militarized country in the world today[3], having the fourth largest standing army in the world

Militarized doesn't mean squat. Any tool can issue the whole male population with AKs, that doesn't make them an effective force or a threat. Prior to the '91 war Iraq also had a massive military. How long did they last? We can strike in wind or rain, day or night from beyond visual range. They cannot.

Reminds me of the old British rhyme: Whatever happens we have got | the maxim gun and they have not.

at nearly 1.2 million armed personnel, with about 20% of men ages 17–54 in the regular armed forces.[4]

Conscripts operating 40 year old weapons systems.

It also has the Worker-Peasant Red Guard, a reserve force comprising 3.5m+ (IISS), 3.8m (USMC) or 4.7m (State Department) militia.

Worker-Peasant Red Guard a.k.a MEATSHIELD or, giving every available man an AK.

an extremely dense air defence system.

Of 60 year old weapons systems and unreliable/poorly designed knock-off missiles. Probably just like the one over Baghdad...oh wait.

They also have a very nice Air Force using Mig 29's which are newer and more advanced than out f-16 or f-18.

Lets see, they operate 30 odd Mig-29 aircraft with the rest of their fleet (the bulk) being 40+ year old Chinese/Russian or Chinese/Russian knock off craft, we're talking the stuff we came up against in Vietnam, Mig-21s, Mig-19s, Mig-17s. They belong in a museum, not on a battlefield, especially the last two.

In every engagement with American aircraft so far, the Mig-29 has fared poorly. In the latest war Iraq did not even bother sending out its air force, preferring to bury them in the sand. In the last war ('91) however, we shot down 42 enemy aircraft, including 5 Mig-29s without a single coalition loss in air-to-air combat.

Where you got the impression that the Mig-29 was superior to American fighters I can't imagine. It's avionics, sensors and weapons systems are all inferior. Most important, the pilots are probably inferior. Against some aircraft I believe it has an edge in maneuverability. Still, overall it is inferior.

 

[LongRange]

a Zastava and an ak-74 are nothing to sneeze at, the same weapons that made the soviet union a world power. as for the mig, well manuverability is everything in air to air combat, the 29 wins.

You keep mentioning 30-40yr old weapons, what is it you think the US has? the m-16 was made in 1965, the AK-74 was made in 1974, so if we are going by age of equipment, we r screwed, and yes, i know we get new ones all the time, well the ak-74 is also still, in production and NKOrea is still buying them every day.

fact is all they need to do is fire a few of these ur our ass...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taepodong-2
thats a 10,000km range nuclear missile. meaning, thats California.


some more fyi...

By the end of the 1990s, it was estimated that North Korea's military-industrial complex operated a diverse array of production plants numbering some 1800 facilities. Among them were forty small arms plants, ten armored vehicle factories, ten shipyards for combat vessels, and fifty explosives facilities. Most of the facilities are located in Chagang Province and other remote inland areas, and are partially or wholly underground to minimize damage in war.

MEANING WE HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THEY ACTUALLY HAVE.

 

[bkeach]

fact is all they need to do is fire a few of these ur our ass...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taepodong-2
thats a 10,000km range nuclear missile. meaning, thats California.

Not sure which missile you are talking about cause the link that you posted says the following about range..

"Based on the size of the missile, the fuel composition, and the likely fuel capacity, it is estimated that a two stage variant would have a range of around 4,000 km (2,500 statute miles) and a three stage variant would be capable of reaching as far as 4,500 km (2,800 statute miles), giving it potentially the longest range in the North Korean missile arsenal.[2] The burn time of each stage is a little over 100 seconds, thus allowing the missile to burn for 5 or 6 minutes. Future highly speculative variants of the missile could be capable of a range of approximately 9,000 km (5,600 statute miles).[4] At maximum range, the Taepodong-2 is estimated to have a payload capacity of less than 500 kg (1,100 lbs).[2]"

So currently (4500km mi)

"Future HIGHLY SPECULATIVE variants of the missile could be capable of 9000km

They cannot hit cali right now with what we know of that they have.

 

[DR.NUMBERS]

a Zastava and an ak-74 are nothing to sneeze at, the same weapons that made the soviet union a world power. as for the mig, well manuverability is everything in air to air combat, the 29 wins.

You keep mentioning 30-40yr old weapons, what is it you think the US has? the m-16 was made in 1965, the AK-74 was made in 1974, so if we are going by age of equipment, we r screwed, and yes, i know we get new ones all the time, well the ak-74 is also still, in production and NKOrea is still buying them every day.

Eh, small arms don't change so much. So in that respect, yes an AK is fine. But vehicles and support tech do/does. A tank designed in the 60's stands no chance against an Abrams. The Abrams out-ranges, out-guns, out-armors it. Same goes for aircraft. That Mig-17's and 19's are still in their active inventory is just more evidence of their meatshield strategy. They could be destroyed before they even were aware of our fighters. The fact that many of these weapons were inferior to their American counterparts at the time when they were designed, does nothing to improve their situation. Inferior in Vietnam, inferior in Iraq (x2), inferior today. I believe our tank force K/D ration against Iraq's T-72's and 80's was also flawless.

Also, the Soviet Union became the empire it was before it adopted the AK.

some more fyi...

By the end of the 1990s, it was estimated that North Korea's military-industrial complex operated a diverse array of production plants numbering some 1800 facilities. Among them were forty small arms plants, ten armored vehicle factories, ten shipyards for combat vessels, and fifty explosives facilities. Most of the facilities are located in Chagang Province and other remote inland areas, and are partially or wholly underground to minimize damage in war.

MEANING WE HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THEY ACTUALLY HAVE.

Where does that statement show we don't know what they have? All that statement says is that they produce weapons and that they try to make their production facilities defensible.

We still have a very good idea of what they have (defectors, surveillance, espionage, military parades).

Rest assured, even if they are producing something we don't somehow know about, the fact that they get $6 billion per year to do it with and we get $711 billion, means ours is still probably better.

 

[JadeRaven]

Rest assured, even if they are producing something we don't somehow know about, the fact that they get $6 billion per year to do it with and we get $711 billion, means ours is still probably better.

And that's not even factoring in South Korea, Japan, et al.

 

[oleheat]

Remember, Iraq had the 4th largest standing army in the world prior to 1990, too.....
I'm just sayin'....numbers don't mean much in this case.
This little turdman is going to be an agitator until he shuts his miserable little eyes for good. IF he ever has the nerve to put any of his loudmouth bs into action, it would only mean the total anialation of his pathetic, starvation-riddled country. The best thing he could do is take a fishing trip on one of his private junks & think this thing through. You don't mess with The Great Satan, least you be sent to hell.

 

[glockthirtysix]

LongRange please contact me ASAP!!! Your inbox is full!

Sorry to hijack the thread....

 

[DR.NUMBERS]

Remember, Iraq had the 4th largest standing army in the world prior to 1990, too.....
I'm just sayin'....numbers don't mean much in this case.
This little turdman is going to be an agitator until he shuts his miserable little eyes for good. IF he ever has the nerve to put any of his loudmouth bs into action, it would only mean the total anialation of his pathetic, starvation-riddled country. The best thing he could do is take a fishing trip on one of his private junks & think this thing through. You don't mess with The Great Satan, least you be sent to hell.

I heard he was grooming a son of his to take his place when he finally kicks it. I hope for his people's sake that they seize power when he does.

 

[Born4spd]

Yea... im thinking you guys are giving way too much credit to Obama.. he cannot and will not make a decision that will cause any harm to international big business or banking. People need to buy one of two things.. Buy ammo, or Buy Anal Lube, either shoot back or get screwed.

The fact is those in power NEED NKorea to bomb US soil, that will give them the ability to do things they otherwise could not do, such as claim Martial Law, disarm citizens "for their own protection" and once the threat is over, the damage is done, and if you think the government will give back your guns, you are a fool.

This wont be the first time it has happened to a sovereign nation, There are 3major causes of an end to a sovereign nation, Race issues, Financial Issues, Outside enemies, One of these reasons have been the cause of the destruction of many sovereign nations in history, from the Romans to the Soviet Union, well people we have ALL THREE RIGHT NOW! there is no way we can fix all 3, so no matter what happens, we are in trouble. If you try and fix the race issue, the finacial issue grows, if you try to fix the financial, then the race issue grows, if you try to fix the outside issues, then both race and financial issues grow.

The United states is actually 2 peoples, We the people the citizens, and we the people the government, this was not the way it was supposed to be, now the problem is that when we the people the citizens become a fair price for materials for the we the people the government, 2 things must happen, either we the people the citizens become wards of the state, or we the people the citizens refuse and revolt. This isnt anything new, how do you think this country began? We are on the verge of something not because of Obama, or Bush or Clinton, but simply because for the past 80 years this country has been run by we the people the government, and as we have seen for the longest time, slowly our nations money has found a home overseas, and the we the people the citizens lives have been traded for oil and commerce.

We the people the government are no longer bound by the confines of this land, no matter who controls it, no matter if it becomes the property of a foreign nation, we the people the government will not lose. we the people the citizens lose, and we the people the citizens are powerless to stop it.

Its easy to explain just as many large ranches in this nation have sold off piece by piece until the original ranch no longer exists, the original owners just walk away with the money and leave the people who originally lived on the land, to find other means of income and housing because that which they lived on and from was sold out from under them. This nation has been sold out from under us, look around, while you were just trying to survive, you were left hanging out to dry, because the government rancher, sold it out from under you, and now he is taking his money and looking at a nice piece of land elsewhere.

Remember the screwing the US government gave my people? the Native americans? well they ran out of Natives to screw, so it seems they found a new group, called the United States Working Class Populus. Aint it a bitch? A bully is a bully, and when the one kid moves away, the bully simply finds another kid to pick on. did you know theres a bill about to be turned lose that will make it MANDATORY for your children to serve in government service? A few other countries have done this.. Germany, China, Cuba,... its called a Communist Dictatorship. Say hello to your new flag... remember folks, Denial is a sign of addiction, not freedom.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtDSwyCPEsQ

Mind if i use this section if i give you credit?

 

[DR.NUMBERS]

Actually, LongRange, in my original statement I said:

"I HIGHLY doubt we will be attacked by North Korea anytime soon"

That was wrong. I believe Kim Jong Il is cracked enough to actually do something like that. He really does strike me as a nutter. What I should have said was:

"I HIGHLY doubt a North Korean attack on the US would end in anything but complete and utter defeat for them."

 

[Bayoupiper]

BINGO! WE HAVE A WINNER!!
WHAT PRIZE DO WE HAVE FOR HIM BOB?
A BRAND NEW GUN!!!

Alright!!


Now I have a matched set!



.

 

[dantheman]

North Korea ain't gonna do **** . It's to their advantage to rattle their sabre's and make threats . That little fart over there knows he couldn't escape the wrath of the U.S. if he really did attack us . This is all a big show for political and economic gain .

 

[blanepara9]

Well whatever happens im sure the soldiers out there are on some sort of alert,confined to base, guard duty etc.... It happened maybe twice when I was there in 2000,but im sure they have been getting their nerves frayed with all this crap for months and months!!! Must freaking suck!!!

 

[dantheman]

All of the Ak's and antique fighters in the world doesn't make for a capable military .
It's all about logistics . You have to be able to MOVE all of those men and weapons , quickly , and at a moments notice . This takes trucks and aircraft . Fuel , tires , batteries , uniforms , boots , medical supplies , you name it . They wouldn't last more than a few days before their supply lines dwindled to nothing . Game over .

 

[DR.NUMBERS]

All of the Ak's and antique fighters in the world doesn't make for a capable military .
It's all about logistics . You have to be able to MOVE all of those men and weapons , quickly , and at a moments notice . This takes trucks and aircraft . Fuel , tires , batteries , uniforms , boots , medical supplies , you name it . They wouldn't last more than a few days before their supply lines dwindled to nothing . Game over .

Yep, no mobilization + no force projection.

 

[LongRange]

yea yea and in 1941 our navy was the biggest and badest... until Japan blew the living **** out of us at a place called pearl harbor, the mistake the Japanese made was they didnt keep going, if they would have, this wouldnt be the USA, NKOrea can read too, they know the same mistakes and they wont make them, you keep mentioning alllll the stuff we have, well if they hit first we lose alot of that really cool stuff. I dont see us hitting first.
Something my Uncle earl who was marooned on a japanese occupied island once told me... Asians dont know the meaning of the word Bluff.. its an honor thing, if they say they are going to do it, they will try, even if it means death.

This is no bluff people, something American is going to get hit, sure, maybe we will win a retalitory strike, maybe not, either way, TEOTWAWKI. Laws and Rights will change, and the american citizens will get the short end of the stick, wait and see.