a video about Civil war, and the first depression

[rooster]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVOeqwUHRSQ[/ame]
Great to see real history spoken. By the way, if any are interested The Judge will be in Lake Charles in SEP.

 

[Leopardcurdog]

Lincoln was, in my opinion, the biggest POS to ever hold the office of president. There are a bunch of books that point out how terrible a person he really was! Not the humble back woods rail splitter he is often portrayed. Thanks for posting that!

 

[Doug.38PR]

Very good! We need a governor and legislature in Louisiana that understands this concept and ENFORCES it! The Governor has a lot of armed citizens that would be more than willing to back him up as organized militias if the Obama wants to put his boot on our necks

 

[Doug.38PR]

Lincoln was, in my opinion, the biggest POS to ever hold the office of president. There are a bunch of books that point out how terrible a person he really was! Not the humble back woods rail splitter he is often portrayed. Thanks for posting that!

Yeah, but those are just crackpots and "neo" confederates anybody who doesn't think Lincoln was the greatest president in the world that saved the Hoooly and Gloooorious Uuuunion from eeeevil slaveholding traitors (that of course, spent their spare time raping slave women, fathering slave children, trying to figure out ways to break up families, bred slaves like cattle and ended every day by whipping slaves or cutting their hands off) that sought to destroy the greatest country on earth is just a "neo"-Confederate
You need to get right with Lincoln, Leopardcurdog

 

[rooster]

Yeah it's funny how most of my friends hold up Lincoln, FDR and JFK as the best presidents and I view them as some of the worst. Them and Gorge W,(if for only the patriot act).

 

[Yrdawg]

Yeah it's funny how most of my friends hold up Lincoln, FDR and JFK as the best presidents and I view them as some of the worst. Them and Gorge W,(if for only the patriot act).

Not to mention the inter galactic hiway from chile to russia.....and understanding the need for affordable labor in the US

Look into the Rhodes scholar thing......

for the record, I am insulting Shrub

 

[Mjolnir]

Hmmm, I much prefer Abraham Lincoln over support of the Rothschild-financed, French & Vatican-supported and heavily Freemasonic-influenced British Crown anyday and twenty times during a Leap Year. Look up:

John James Gourgas
Lionel & James Rothschild (they were funding both sides)
Augus "Belmont" (real name Schoenberg)
Jay Cooke
the Seligman brothers
Judah P. Benjamin
John Slidell
the d'Erlanger family
Giuseppe Mazzini
Albert Pike

just to name a few demons.

These same "great" southern Leaders promised the British & French both Louisiana and Texas to Napoleon III... Heroes they were NOT.

ONE source would be Nicholas Hagger's book titled The Secret Founding of America

When viewed as just one more war with the (British) Crown things fall very precisely into place - including Lincoln's assassination, the attempt on William Seward and the attempt the following year on the Czar of Russia (who lent assistance to Lincoln to thwart the Brits and French.

 

[Doug.38PR]

Is this another Dan Brown book? or a National Treasure movie?

I've never had anything per se against Free Masons, The Catholic Church or even the British Crown.

There are theories that had the South won that they would have become a Commonwealth or Dominion of the British Empire so long as their liberty and rights were protected. Southern Partisan Magazine had an interesting What IF article about that about 10 or 15 years ago. (A what If scenario something I tend to doubt given that the forefathers of the South used everything they had to be free of the British Empire.)

The Vatican was the one nation that officially recognized the Confederacy. The Pope sent a crown of thorns to Jefferson Davis when he was illegally and brutally imprisoned.

John Slidel, was a Confederate ambassador to Britain and France attempting to secure their alliance against the Union the same way Ben Franklin did in the first War of Independence.

Albert Pike made Dixie from a folk song into a fighting song.

I noted a lot of Jewish names on that list, Jews were loyal and devouted citizens of the Confederacy and the Antebellum South and enjoyed much liberty and good relations with their Gentile neighbors (See The Jewish Confederates by Robert Rosen). My mother and father both remember prominent Jewish families in both of their hometowns that were good friends and neighbors. In fact, Seligmans is an old name with an old department store in my mom's hometown (now my home) here in Louisiana.

Masons were supportive of both sides of the War. This is nothing new. Know-Nothings of the North were anti-Mason and Anti-Catholic but they were a minority and largely sectional party.

Given that Lincoln destroyed the sovereign states and imposed a centralized nationstate in the model of the French, German and Russian Revolutions of Europe (which gave us Hitler and Napoleon and Stalin) I'd say call your list of men heros compared to the likes of Lincoln (and William Seward and the bell on his desk) who, in the manner of Hitler, Napleon and Stalin, brutally overthrew local jurisdictions and culture....especially given the results we are faced with today.

 

[Mjolnir]

Is this another Dan Brown book?

No, it's called history as publicly documented - if not generally discussed (in polite company).

 

[Doug.38PR]

conspiracy theories and "demons" are something of a stretch though. As I said, those things are not "secret" foundings nor are they anything sinister.

Britain I'm sure had their own reasons for wanting to see the United States break up, but that doesn't mean that the Confederacy or her prominent representatives were secretly conspiring to destroy the Confederacy at the pay of a foreign power

 

[Mjolnir]

Yeah, sure. History IS Conspiracy. It's the name of the game in Geopolitics.

I don't know why people have apoplectic fits at anything that suggests secrecy but that's the history of the world.

And you may find history very "interesting" if you dig a bit deeper. Nothing I've stated isn't in the public record and has been for some time.

 

[Mjolnir]

Is this another Dan Brown book? or a National Treasure movie?

I've never had anything per se against Free Masons, The Catholic Church or even the British Crown.

There are theories that had the South won that they would have become a Commonwealth or Dominion of the British Empire so long as their liberty and rights were protected. Southern Partisan Magazine had an interesting What IF article about that about 10 or 15 years ago. (A what If scenario something I tend to doubt given that the forefathers of the South used everything they had to be free of the British Empire.)

The Vatican was the one nation that officially recognized the Confederacy. The Pope sent a crown of thorns to Jefferson Davis when he was illegally and brutally imprisoned.

Theres a helluva lot more to that bastard Albert Pike, my friend.

John Slidel, was a Confederate ambassador to Britain and France attempting to secure their alliance against the Union the same way Ben Franklin did in the first War of Independence.

Albert Pike made Dixie from a folk song into a fighting song.

I noted a lot of Jewish names on that list, Jews were loyal and devouted citizens of the Confederacy and the Antebellum South and enjoyed much liberty and good relations with their Gentile neighbors (See The Jewish Confederates by Robert Rosen). My mother and father both remember prominent Jewish families in both of their hometowns that were good friends and neighbors. In fact, Seligmans is an old name with an old department store in my mom's hometown (now my home) here in Louisiana.

Masons were supportive of both sides of the War. This is nothing new. Know-Nothings of the North were anti-Mason and Anti-Catholic but they were a minority and largely sectional party.

Given that Lincoln destroyed the sovereign states and imposed a centralized nationstate in the model of the French, German and Russian Revolutions of Europe (which gave us Hitler and Napoleon and Stalin) I'd say call your list of men heros compared to the likes of Lincoln (and William Seward and the bell on his desk) who, in the manner of Hitler, Napleon and Stalin, brutally overthrew local jurisdictions and culture....especially given the results we are faced with today.

What became of what Lincoln preserved was perverted upon his deathbed. No more and no less. The sick system we have is modeled after the **** from EUrope - Britain, in particular. Ironic, aint it???

 

[Doug.38PR]

Lincoln didn't preserve anything. He in fact destroyed the Union of Sovereign States created by the Founding Fathers. He was supported by German immigrants (the 48'ers), Abolitionist, Unitarian and other radicals who wanted a centralized nationstate.

The worldview of these people are exactly what we have today, a central government that tramples on our liberty and controls our lives.

You want to talk about secrecy and conspiracies, consider the Northern Industrialists and Abolitionists that worked together to subvert the Union of States to create a central government. That's what the Republcian Party was made up of.

Ask yourself this: Would you prefer the overthrow, burning and destruction of 13 states, more lives lost on both sides than all wars put together in American History to the Confederate States of America being allowed to exist? (even a confederacy that decided on their own liberty, as a sovereign state, to join the British Empire?)

That's what Lincoln did.

 

[Mjolnir]

You support the British Crown, the Illuminati (Albert Pike, Mazzini, Rothschilds) then???

It wasn't 13 states. The number thirteen refers to the Knights Templar not the thirteen states (that didn't value the life and liberty of the Africans it held in servitude). They also were proponents of "Free Trade" - not surprising since it's a British Crown invention via Ricardo.

No, that is NOT what Lincoln did. He did not (nor did the Abolitionists, in general) destroy the Union; The "illuminated" freemasonic banker elite and their pawns did that starting with South Carolina.

The irony of ironies is that the system we have is the system supported by the Crown and the Crown Agents. If you don't like it now then you surely shouldn't "support" it back in the late 18th century.

 

[Doug.38PR]

You support the British Crown,

Didn't say that. I support the sovereignty of the states, even if they choose to join the British Empire

the Illuminati (Albert Pike, Mazzini, Rothschilds) then???

Masons are some of the best people in your local Church. Sure I support them, I may not agree with all their claims or even masonry in general, but they have a right to their belief.

It wasn't 13 states.

Texas, Louisiana, Florida, Alabama, Mississippi, South Carolina, North Carolina, Virginia, Tennessee, Arkansas, Missouri, Kentucky, Georgia. That's 13. Represents the 13 stars on the Confederate flags. Though 2 of those upper south states weren't able to secede (because Yankee troops moved in and/or arrested state legislatures, including the legislature of Maryland, shut down newspapers and arrested anybody else who dared disagree with Lincoln)

This of course isn't counting the violations of liberty Lincoln, Seward and his Radical Republicans imposed on the Northern states.

(that didn't value the life and liberty of the Africans it held in servitude).

You mean those black people that were only a generation or less removed for primitive barbarians that lived in tribal paganism in the wilds of Africa that had no understanding of Western Civilization and what made it free and great? Who were know to slaughter white people in places like Haiti? Well in fact many of them did value their lives and even liberty to some degree or another. Theologically the Church opposed cruel treatment to slaves (the South was/is known as the Bible Belt) and favored teaching them the ways of the Bible and valued them as spiritually equal and made in the Image of God, legally many states passed laws protecting the humanity of slaves, socially a man who would abuse his slaves was regarded as a moral pyriah and outcast. Prior to the Radical Abolitionist movement in the 1830s, I believe 3 our of 4 anti-slavery societies were in the South.
This of course doesn't mean that the South was perfect (far from it). The South did, at least politically in some circles, turn hard against any suggestion of gradual emancipation and defended the institution from top to bottom in defensive response to Radical Abolitionists. There were ridged laws on the books forbidding slaves from reading and writing without the master's consent or sometimes even with. But realistically they were not enforced on the local and realistic level. (Stonewall Jackson started a highly successful Sunday School class which taught slaves to read, write and the Bible, Jefferson Davis had a slave judicial system on his Plantation to where slaves judge civil and criminal matters on their own to teach them the value of freedom and liberty). True, there were breakups of families occasionally, there were cruel masters, cruel people in general then as now.

The northern states certainly didn't give a rats-hind-end about the Life and LIberty and well being of blacks and in fact many regarded them as the Missing Link in Darwin's evolution theory. Many northern states passed laws preventing blacks from entering their states. The notion that the North lauched a war to free slaves is laughable. The Abolitionist and Republican aggitation against slavery was more a weapon than it was a moral issue

They also were proponents of "Free Trade" - not surprising since it's a British Crown invention via Ricardo.

Yes they were for free trade. This is good. I'm for free trade. People have the right to trade with whom they please. The Government should not impose a monopoly on one section against another section.

No, that is NOT what Lincoln did. He did not (nor did the Abolitionists, in general) destroy the Union; The "illuminated" freemasonic banker elite and their pawns did that starting with South Carolina.

The South secede...Lincoln invaded....that's destroying the Union. As Robert E. Lee said, a Union that can only be maintained with swords and bayonets isn't worth having anyway.

The irony of ironies is that the system we have is the system supported by the Crown and the Crown Agents. If you don't like it now then you surely shouldn't "support" it back in the late 18th century.

We have an all powerful central government today...whether this benefits "the Crown" or not (WW1 and WW2 with Wilson and Roosevelt alone suggest that it supports the British) is irrelevant. It tramples on our liberties and sovereign states. We have Lincoln to thank for this.

 

[Mjolnir]

Dude, you can't have it all ways. The Crown was behind the Southern Freemasonists (who were led by SATANIST Crown Agents Albert Pike, Guiseppe Mazzini and Mackey - I forget the bastard's first name). In fact, in a letter he put in in 1889 (?) to 23 Freemasonic Supreme Councils Albert Pike states that "Lucifer is God". Knights of the Golden Circle, they were. And their military arm is the KKK. Beautiful... And then we have Mazzini's Young America and the Knights Templar Southern Jurisdiction who served as "the glue" to fester it all together.

As far as Lincoln "destroying" the Union is downright laughable and INCORRECT. The South seceded prior to Lincoln's inauguration so the Union was "destroyed" before he officially took office. Look it up. So your statement that Lincoln "destroyed" the USA is fallacious reasoning at best. The Arthurian Legend so embraced in the Deep South was/is just that: legend. You cannot deprive a man of liberty and then demand your own "before God", even. That dog don't hunt. If Lee claimed what you state he did then he should have put down his rifle. The North was also controlled and manipulated by the Rothschilds. I think it was Lionel Rothschild who was the man behind the scenes in the North.

Your argument concerning slavery is appallingly poorly thought out. I can't believe you'd even bother type that... And I know better than you the racism in the North towards Blacks. I never claimed that the war was DIRECTLY about Slavery. I implied the war was to sink the USA as an independent, powerful nation state. Slavery was the issue so emotionally attached to the Southern plantation farmer and elite of the Deep South.

As far as the Haitian SLAVE REVOLT is concerned it was a fight for liberty, dude. Did they have to kill everyone? I'd think not but they did what they felt they had to do. No more and no less.

As far as Blacks being viewed by some in the North as a missing link I think we could safely argue that a greater percentage of Whites in the Deep South believed that than in the North...

Research how Lincoln defeated the Freemasonic Rothschild financiers and it is historical FACT that LA and TX were offered for foreign support in a war OF SLAVERY as it was their goal to have a slavocracy in the Deep South, Central America and the northern part of South America with Havana, Cuba at the epicenter. "Struggle for 'Liberty'?" TOTAL ********.

Your support of "Free Trade" (that the Southern Plantation Owners strongly believed in) has nothing to do with "people having the 'right' to buy from whomever." It's about the economic viability of nation states. CAFTA, NAFTA, GATT, WTO, NAU are creatures of.... THE BRITISH CROWN & THEIR CROWN AGENTS. The same personages who fomented the secession movement down here. The same people who created and supported the KKK and the racial tensions down here immediately following the Civil War. Let us also not forget the United Nations Organization which takes YOUR money, YOUR equipment and uses YOUR fellow citizens to undermine other sovereign nations while undermining your own national sovereignty. It, too, is a creature of London (The City, that is).

I think you might wish to re-evaluate your allegiances. If you choose contrary, that's "cool", too. But the irony of your "beliefs" of the Civil War and the current political/economic quagmire we find ourselves is as thick as thieves. I don't think you realize from whence the threats we have come from. Most AMERICANS don't. Your Founding Fathers sure as Hades did, though. But we don't actually READ our Founding Fathers anymore... do we? We remain the laughingstock of the world because we free will refuse to study our history.

On this subject we MUST agree to disagree (quite vehemently, may I add).

 

[Doug.38PR]

On this subject we MUST agree to disagree (quite vehemently, may I add).

That works for me I've stated my case, you've stated your case. Let's leave it at that. It all speaks for itself.

 

[DuckYou]

Lincoln was, in my opinion, the biggest POS to ever hold the office of president. There are a bunch of books that point out how terrible a person he really was! Not the humble back woods rail splitter he is often portrayed. Thanks for posting that!

I think that Obama is worse, although Lincoln ended state sovereignty.

 

[stancel]

I heard this lecture some time ago. It is a really good unbiased look at Lincoln. It is long, but worth it.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5wdfV-UaLI&feature=related[/ame]

 

[Doug.38PR]

Stancel, I've never heard Dr. Donald Livingston speak...actually I think I did hear him in Hot Springs, Ark. some years ago at a history symposium. He is very good, thanks for posting, I'm going to seek out the rest of that lecture.