CC in a purse question

[jmcrawf1]

I have not seen such an exception in any Louisiana law. I'll wait for Jake to post it.

It doesn’t exist


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[leadslinger972]

It doesn’t exist

 

[Bigchillin83]

lmbo

 

[leadslinger972]

I think the law you two are referring to is the transportation of firearms. You are not legally allowed to transport your firearm in a holster concealed on your person without a Louisiana CHP.

 

[bigjakewelch]

Can you point me to the exception that allows you to conceal carry without a permit in your home, or in your car under the "movables law"? I am not aware of any such exception.

Inside your home a firearm has no other designation other than a "movable" or personal property. Therefore you can keep it or store it in any fashion you consider necessary. The ownership of the firearm is covered by the 2nd amendment, and the state constitution, this same set of statutes will also cover you while you are in your vehicle. All of the laws that prohibit concealed weapons or the concealing of firearms have a direct correlation with being in public. Your questioning to the fact of there being no law protecting this right is null by way of the constitution. You may ask then if the cops come into your home and you have a concealed weapon on your person, well that would be covered by the 4th amendment. They would be required to have a warrent, and would give you time to declare that you have it on your person. I'll ask you a question, can you own a firearm if you live within a school zone = gun free zone? The answer is yes, it's covered by the 2nd. This is why I say use common sense when it comes to handling your firearms.
To answer the question about the definition of purse or range bag.... there is none. I can tell you that if you're carrying your man purse in the grocery store and they suspect you for shoplifting (this would be one of only a few situations that you might be searched by a cop = very unlikley) and the cop finds your pink pistol. You're not going to explain that this is actually your range bag and you're on your way to the range to go shooting.... use common sense.
You guys can go all Herp-Derp on the specific wordage of a certain law that doesn't say that you can't carry a gun on the second Sunday of the third month if you're wearing red shoes...... that specific law doesn't exist. That action is covered by another more general law.
I'll leave you with this there is a law that says it's illegal to be naked. It also states that in order to be in violation of this law you must also be in public. The indecency clause covers this in a vague overview. If you look at this clause in Herp-Derp literal translation it means that you would be in violation of it if your wife was in the bathroom at the same time you were taking a shower. But the overall intent of this law has nothing to do with that. It would never hold up in court, nor would you be arrested for it, and if you were (in some strange set of circumstances) you would probably have a pretty good case of unlawful arrest, and a pretty good civil suit to boot.
I've gone into this long explanation to prove that if you only use a little common sense while handling your firearm you will never have a confrontation with the law. We aren't in California or New Jersey, our gun laws (here in Louisiana) are some of the most lax (best). We are a shall issue state and if you're concerned about being in violation of the CHP law, then go get you a permit. Problem solved.

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[leadslinger972]

Inside your home a firearm has no other designation other than a "movable" or personal property. Therefore you can keep it or store it in any fashion you consider necessary. The ownership of the firearm is covered by the 2nd amendment, and the state constitution, this same set of statutes will also cover you while you are in your vehicle. All of the laws that prohibit concealed weapons or the concealing of firearms have a direct correlation with being in public. Your questioning to the fact of there being no law protecting this right is null by way of the constitution. You may ask then if the cops come into your home and you have a concealed weapon on your person, well that would be covered by the 4th amendment. They would be required to have a warrent, and would give you time to declare that you have it on your person. I'll ask you a question, can you own a firearm if you live within a school zone = gun free zone? The answer is yes, it's covered by the 2nd. This is why I say use common sense when it comes to handling your firearms.
To answer the question about the definition of purse or range bag.... there is none. I can tell you that if you're carrying your man purse in the grocery store and they suspect you for shoplifting (this would be one of only a few situations that you might be searched by a cop = very unlikley) and the cop finds your pink pistol. You're not going to explain that this is actually your range bag and you're on your way to the range to go shooting.... use common sense.
You guys can go all Herp-Derp on the specific wordage of a certain law that doesn't say that you can't carry a gun on the second Sunday of the third month if you're wearing red shoes...... that specific law doesn't exist. That action is covered by another more general law.
I'll leave you with this there is a law that says it's illegal to be naked. It also states that in order to be in violation of this law you must also be in public. The indecency clause covers this in a vague overview. If you look at this clause in Herp-Derp literal translation it means that you would be in violation of it if your wife was in the bathroom at the same time you were taking a shower. But the overall intent of this law has nothing to do with that. It would never hold up in court, nor would you be arrested for it, and if you were (in some strange set of circumstances) you would probably have a pretty good case of unlawful arrest, and a pretty good civil suit to boot.
I've gone into this long explanation to prove that if you only use a little common sense while handling your firearm you will never have a confrontation with the law. We aren't in California or New Jersey, our gun laws (here in Louisiana) are some of the most lax (best). We are a shall issue state and if you're concerned about being in violation of the CHP law, then go get you a permit. Problem solved.

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Are you an attorney?

 

[dougstump]

Before I retired from the City, I used to love the discussions I had with the Police at the city gas pumps. One very knowledgeable officer told me, in no uncertain terms, that a Louisiana Concealed Handgun Permit allowed me to carry, but it had to be visible and could not be loaded. If I had any ammunition on my person I would be arrested. If you want to know what the law says, don't ask your average police officer! Not trying to "bash the cops", but sadly most are given bad information at the Academy and never actually read the laws.

 

[leadslinger972]

Before I retired from the City, I used to love the discussions I had with the Police at the city gas pumps. One very knowledgeable officer told me, in no uncertain terms, that a Louisiana Concealed Handgun Permit allowed me to carry, but it had to be visible and could not be loaded. If I had any ammunition on my person I would be arrested. If you want to know what the law says, don't ask your average police officer! Not trying to "bash the cops", but sadly most are given bad information at the Academy and never actually read the laws.

It's your duty to know and understand the law as much as it is the officer's duty. Have you been to a police academy? Do you know they give bad information? Do you know they do not read the applicable statutes?

 

[bigjakewelch]

Are you an attorney?

Are you????
You want to see a specific law that doesn't exist on its own it is covered by several laws. So I'll ask you a question. Show me where a person was convicted for having their firearm in a case while transporting it from the car to the house, from the house to the car, from the car to the range, from the range to the car......ect where there were no other circumstances involved...... You can't. It doesn't exist. People get really hung up on these "what if" situations that will never happen. This is why I have and will always say USE COMMON SENSE when caring your firearm. Wether it be CC, OPC, or just transporting it. You have laws that protect your right to have them, but it's better not to need to call on these laws to get you out of jail (because you were being careless while handling your firearm)

If you still need my personal/professional resume I can send you a PM. If rather not cover that in the public forum. Lol.

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[leadslinger972]

Are you????
You want to see a specific law that doesn't exist on its own it is covered by several laws. So I'll ask you a question. Show me where a person was convicted for having their firearm in a case while transporting it from the car to the house, from the house to the car, from the car to the range, from the range to the car......ect where there were no other circumstances involved...... You can't. It doesn't exist. People get really hung up on these "what if" situations that will never happen. This is why I have and will always say USE COMMON SENSE when caring your firearm. Wether it be CC, OPC, or just transporting it. You have laws that protect your right to have them, but it's better not to need to call on these laws to get you out of jail (because you were being careless while handling your firearm)

If you still need my personal/professional resume I can send you a PM. If rather not cover that in the public forum. Lol.

I'm asking if you're an attorney, because you are very firm in your beliefs about Federal and State laws. It would be detrimental to the forum and to members if you were stating incorrect information.

There are statutes that cover transportation of firearms. There are also statutes on the illegal carrying of weapons. Are you stating that we as responsible gun owners should not follow the law and carry concealed without a permit, so long as we use common sense and do not get caught? That sounds like what you are saying.

 

[dougstump]

It's your duty to know and understand the law as much as it is the officer's duty. Have you been to a police academy? Do you know they give bad information? Do you know they do not read the applicable statutes?

From my experience, the ones that start the comment off with "Well, at the Academy" have no clue what the law says. I have a friend who happens to be a Judge. Several times he's had a police officer on the stand tell him that he didn't know what the law was. I would have paid good money to hear that discussion.

And no, I've never attended a police academy, I'm allergic to donuts!

 

[JoeLiberty]

I was just reading on another sight about CC'ing and the deal about a purse came up.

I think I heard awhile back where a woman could carry in a purse without a CHP. Was that right or was I hearing things?

You are thinking of Mississippi. They changed the law a couple years ago to allow permitless carry in a bag. Not so in LA.
http://www.msnewsnow.com/story/28814952/packing-heat-in-purses-without-a-permit

 

[bigjakewelch]

I'm asking if you're an attorney, because you are very firm in your beliefs about Federal and State laws. It would be detrimental to the forum and to members if you were stating incorrect information.

There are statutes that cover transportation of firearms. There are also statutes on the illegal carrying of weapons. Are you stating that we as responsible gun owners should not follow the law and carry concealed without a permit, so long as we use common sense and do not get caught? That sounds like what you are saying.

No, I am in no way saying you should break the laws that prohibit concealed weapons. I addressed the possession of a firearm on your person while you are in your home/in your vehicle. As far as transport from vehicle to range. Have you ever walked in a range that didn't have a sign that stated that you have your weapons unloaded before entering? Or that your firearms should be in a closed range bag? If you read all of the posts you would see that there is a specific clause on intent. This is an objective action that is left up to the discernment of the officer or officers responding to the situation that got your bags searched in the first place. If you're walking from your car to the range and can prove the intent of going to the range, you then have a "defence to prosecution". If you're walking thru Walmart, then there is no way you can prove your intent wasn't to conceal a firearm = no defense to prosecution.
I will repeat what I said in one of the earlier posts. If you are concerned wether you are in violation of the CHP law. Louisiana is a "Shall Issue State" if you can legally own a pistol then there is a 98% you will get approved for the CHP. Get one and then there should be no question.
As far as incorrect information, this is free information and I won't be held responsible for someone that takes this information as being professional or direct legal advice. Do the research for yourself, all of this information is public, or you can pay a retainer to legal council and get the same information for a price. It's your choice, I can tell you that if you're this concerned about being in violation of the law then you would be cheaper getting your CHP. I can refer you to some reputable instructors that cover this matter at detail in their course curriculum.
Let's not get hung up on this "I'm righter than you are" stuff. You made a couple of really good points. But for the most part the "what if" situations will rarely (almost never) happen like they are presented. There are always other circumstances involved in how this could and would play out. So many , that you could never have one law that would cover in all cases. This is why these laws are written down in books (many books).
The legality of things can either way (guilty/not guilty) depending on the judgement of 12. This is the reason for the 1st circuit court of appeals (in my area of the state) The goal is to stay out of the court all together. This is why I say use common sense, educate yourself, and if you're questioning the action then you have options. Public information, legal council, or just get your CHP.

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[JoeLiberty]

I'll ask you a question, can you own a firearm if you live within a school zone = gun free zone? The answer is yes, it's covered by the 2nd. This is why I say use common sense when it comes to handling your firearms.

the answer is yes, because it is covered by the specific statute:

LRS 14:95.2
§95.2. Carrying a firearm, or dangerous weapon, by a student or nonstudent on school
property, at school-sponsored functions or firearm-free zone
...
C. The provisions of this Section shall not apply to:
...
(4) The possession of a firearm occurring within one thousand feet of school property
and entirely on private property, or entirely within a private residence, or in accordance with a
concealed handgun permit issued pursuant to R.S. 40:1379.1 or R.S. 40:1379.3.
(5) Any constitutionally protected activity which cannot be regulated by the state, such
as a firearm contained entirely within a motor vehicle.

they also state it here, where they define gun-free zone:

R.S. 14:95.6 Firearm-Free Zone; Notice; Signs; Crime; Penalties
A. A "firearm-free zone" is an area inclusive of any school campus and within one thousand feet of any such
school campus, and within a school bus, wherein the possession of firearms is prohibited, except as
specifically set forth in Subsection B of this Section and R.S. 14:95.2(C).
B. The Provisions of This Section Shall not Apply To:
...
(4) Private premises where a firearm is kept pursuant to law.
(5) Any constitutionally protected activity within the firearm-free zone, such as a firearm contained
entirely within a motor vehicle.

There is no such carve out for concealed carry in your own home or vehicle. It may very well be a constitutionally protected activity,especially given the change in wording. BUT currently there is no statute supporting the practice, and there is one forbidding it. AND there is also no case law (that I know of) to set a precedent for it... so if you get caught, you could spend the rest of your life fighting that legal battle. Luckily, a few years back, we changed our constitution to say this:

§11. Right to Keep and Bear Arms
Section 11. The right of each citizen to keep and
bear arms is fundamental and shall not be infringed.
Any restriction on this right shall be subject to strict
scrutiny.

...So you'd actually have a pretty good shot. But then again, CHP is what? $250 including training? That court case would be in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, so your call really. If you're going to advise your students... I'd advise them not to do this.

 

[leadslinger972]

the answer is yes, because it is covered by the specific statute:

they also state it here, where they define gun-free zone:

There is no such carve out for concealed carry in your own home or vehicle. It may very well be a constitutionally protected activity,especially given the change in wording. BUT currently there is no statute supporting the practice, and there is one forbidding it. AND there is also no case law (that I know of) to set a precedent for it... so if you get caught, you could spend the rest of your life fighting that legal battle. Luckily, a few years back, we changed our constitution to say this:

...So you'd actually have a pretty good shot. But then again, CHP is what? $250 including training? That court case would be in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, so your call really. If you're going to advise your students... I'd advise them not to do this.

Joe, you said everything I was preparing to say

Louisiana is a state where everything is prohibited, but there are some exceptions.

 

[leadslinger972]

No, I am in no way saying you should break the laws that prohibit concealed weapons. I addressed the possession of a firearm on your person while you are in your home/in your vehicle. As far as transport from vehicle to range. Have you ever walked in a range that didn't have a sign that stated that you have your weapons unloaded before entering? Or that your firearms should be in a closed range bag? If you read all of the posts you would see that there is a specific clause on intent. This is an objective action that is left up to the discernment of the officer or officers responding to the situation that got your bags searched in the first place. If you're walking from your car to the range and can prove the intent of going to the range, you then have a "defence to prosecution". If you're walking thru Walmart, then there is no way you can prove your intent wasn't to conceal a firearm = no defense to prosecution.
I will repeat what I said in one of the earlier posts. If you are concerned wether you are in violation of the CHP law. Louisiana is a "Shall Issue State" if you can legally own a pistol then there is a 98% you will get approved for the CHP. Get one and then there should be no question.
As far as incorrect information, this is free information and I won't be held responsible for someone that takes this information as being professional or direct legal advice. Do the research for yourself, all of this information is public, or you can pay a retainer to legal council and get the same information for a price. It's your choice, I can tell you that if you're this concerned about being in violation of the law then you would be cheaper getting your CHP. I can refer you to some reputable instructors that cover this matter at detail in their course curriculum.
Let's not get hung up on this "I'm righter than you are" stuff. You made a couple of really good points. But for the most part the "what if" situations will rarely (almost never) happen like they are presented. There are always other circumstances involved in how this could and would play out. So many , that you could never have one law that would cover in all cases. This is why these laws are written down in books (many books).
The legality of things can either way (guilty/not guilty) depending on the judgement of 12. This is the reason for the 1st circuit court of appeals (in my area of the state) The goal is to stay out of the court all together. This is why I say use common sense, educate yourself, and if you're questioning the action then you have options. Public information, legal council, or just get your CHP.

I never mentioned anything about a firearm in a bag. I mentioned specifically about a firearm on your person, assuming you understood I was not talking about off body carry. If you have a loaded firearm, in a holster, in your waistband, without a Louisiana Concealed Handgun Permit, then you are illegally carrying a weapon. It does not matter where you are.

I have not stated any "what if" situations.

 

[bigjakewelch]

I never mentioned anything about a firearm in a bag. I mentioned specifically about a firearm on your person, assuming you understood I was not talking about off body carry. If you have a loaded firearm, in a holster, in your waistband, without a Louisiana Concealed Handgun Permit, then you are illegally carrying a weapon. It does not matter where you are.

I have not stated any "what if" situations.

Show me where this is stated to be illegal in the confines of your home? This would be covered by the state constitution and the general confines of the 2nd amendment. Everything that states the legality of CC is in the context of public domain. There is no provision that prohibits inside of "your" private dwelling. If you can find it then I will publicly hail you king of the internet for the day. Lol.
The Op is questioning about carrying in a purse. I was just doing my best to stay on topic. With the references to the range bags verses purses and intent.

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[leadslinger972]

Show me where this is stated to be illegal in the confines of your home? This would be covered by the state constitution and the general confines of the 2nd amendment. Everything that states the legality of CC is in the context of public domain. There is no provision that prohibits inside of "your" private dwelling. If you can find it then I will publicly hail you king of the internet for the day. Lol.
The Op is questioning about carrying in a purse. I was just doing my best to stay on topic. With the references to the range bags verses purses and intent.

[FONT=&quot]§95. Illegal carrying of weapons[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] A. Illegal carrying of weapons is:[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] (1) The intentional concealment of any firearm, or other instrumentality customarily used or intended for probable use as a dangerous weapon, on one's person
[/FONT]

Nowhere does it state anything about a location. Can you provide the statute that allows concealed carry in your home without a permit?

The question asked in the OP was already answered.

 

[Bigchillin83]

I never mentioned anything about a firearm in a bag. I mentioned specifically about a firearm on your person, assuming you understood I was not talking about off body carry. If you have a loaded firearm, in a holster, in your waistband, without a Louisiana Concealed Handgun Permit, then you are illegally carrying a weapon. It does not matter where you are.

I have not stated any "what if" situations.

so it has to be in a holster and loaded? to be concealed by the letter of the law?

 

[Bigchillin83]

says RON.....