Edited due to e-stalking by Vanilla Gorilla

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  • Metryshooter

    Well-Known Member
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    Jul 11, 2010
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    Don't feel too badly, where I work I can't even have a weapon in my vehicle. Notice I said weapon, not just firearm. If I were to have a hunting knife and my vehicle got searched I'd be gone and likely prosecuted. What was it you were saying about stupid gubment?
     

    sraacke

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    Jan 19, 2009
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    I liked the way they did it at E Hunt prison when I worked there. You can't leave the stuff in your car in the lot but all you had to do was walk up to the gate and the guards would issue you a key for a gunlocker to store your pistol, ammo, whatever. Got a long gun? No prob. Just tag it and put it in the big locker. Never any hassle and beats all of the stupid stuff I see at other work sites. Angola and other state prisons do the same thing. Declare what you have and lock it up then pick it up when you leave. So simple.
     

    Guate_shooter

    LA CHP Instructor # 522
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    Dec 4, 2009
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    Unfurtunetly its a private business ( I assume ) so they can do whatever they want on their "property" as far as heaving a lock box eventhough is a great tool and idea is very unlikely, the % of gun owners that know how to safely operate a weapon is very low and the liability of somebody heaving a ND while putting it in the safe box is too high for untrained citizens.

    If I was the gun owner I wouldnt want that liability on my property.

    Car is another story and they cant do much as long as its not a gated lot.
     

    Yrdawg

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    Sep 24, 2006
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    Big Woods
    Don't feel too badly, where I work I can't even have a weapon in my vehicle. Notice I said weapon, not just firearm. If I were to have a hunting knife and my vehicle got searched I'd be gone and likely prosecuted. What was it you were saying about stupid gubment?

    What would be the charge for violating private policy...other than maybe a trespass ??

    o rmaybe you work for Gubmint....didn't think about that
     
    Last edited:

    Tim67

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    Jul 20, 2010
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    Probably.

    Someone please correct if I'm wrong but in Louisiana carrying on any property where the owner/manager says no by sign is the same thing as someone carrying without a permit, right?

    I didnt carry there because my shirt didnt really hide the gun and I really want the job.

    If hired the thing that will make me not carry isn't fear of getting fired. It is the fear of losing the ability to carry everywhere else for 6 months or whatever.

    I think it's either that or "remaining after forbidden"
     

    Guate_shooter

    LA CHP Instructor # 522
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    Dec 4, 2009
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    A few things to consider are these, since you are NOT covered by the provisions of your CHP.

    RS 40:1382
    §1382. Negligent carrying of a concealed handgun

    A. Negligent carrying of a concealed handgun is the intentional or criminally negligent carrying by any person, whether or not authorized or licensed to carry or possess a concealed handgun, under the following circumstances:

    (1) When it is foreseeable that the handgun may discharge, or when others are placed in reasonable apprehension that the handgun may discharge.

    (2) When the handgun is being carried, brandished, or displayed under circumstances that create a reasonable apprehension on the part of members of the public or a law enforcement official that a crime is being committed or is about to be committed.

    B. It shall be within the discretion of the law enforcement officer to issue a summons to a person accused of committing this offense in lieu of making a physical arrest. The seizure of the handgun pending resolution of the offense shall only be discretionary in the instance where the law enforcement officer issues a summons to the person accused. If the law enforcement officer makes a physical arrest of the person accused, the handgun and the person's license to carry such handgun shall be seized.

    C. Whoever commits the offense of negligent carrying of a concealed handgun shall be fined not more than five hundred dollars, or imprisoned without hard labor for not more than six months, or both. The adjudicating judge may also order the forfeiture of the handgun and may suspend or revoke any permit or license authorizing the carrying of the handgun.



    ALSO if you go back and check on LRS 40:1379.3

    §1379.3. Statewide permits for concealed handguns; application procedures; definitions

    A.(1) Notwithstanding any other provision of law to the contrary, the deputy secretary of public safety services of the Department of Public Safety and Corrections shall issue a concealed handgun permit to any Louisiana resident who qualifies for a permit under the provisions of this Section and may promulgate rules and adopt regulations regarding concealed handgun permits in accordance with the Administrative Procedure Act. The permit shall contain a permit number, expiration date, photograph, and the name, address, and date of birth of the permittee.

    (2) Any information in any application for a concealed handgun permit or any information provided in connection with the application submitted to the deputy secretary of public safety services of the Department of Public Safety and Corrections under the provisions of this Section shall be held confidential and shall not be subject to any public records request nor shall the information be considered as a public record pursuant to R.S. 44:1 et seq. The Department of Public Safety and Corrections shall not release any list of persons who applied for or received a permit for a concealed handgun pursuant to this Section. However, nothing contained herein shall limit or impede the free flow of information between law enforcement agencies, prohibit the department from releasing information necessary to perform the background investigation, or provide statistical information which does not identify individual applicants or permittees.

    B.(1) A concealed handgun permit shall be issued only to a Louisiana resident who qualifies for a permit under the provisions of this Section. A concealed handgun permit issued pursuant to the provisions of this Section shall grant authority to a Louisiana resident to carry a concealed handgun on his person.

    (2) A Louisiana resident shall be required to possess a valid concealed handgun permit issued by the state of Louisiana pursuant to the provisions of this Section in order to carry a concealed handgun in the state of Louisiana.

    C. To qualify for a concealed handgun permit, a Louisiana resident shall:

    (1) Make sworn application to the deputy secretary of public safety services of the Department of Public Safety and Corrections. The providing of false or misleading information on the application or any documents submitted with the application shall be grounds for the denial or revocation of a concealed handgun permit. The application shall reflect training in pistols, revolvers, or both. Any permittee under this Section shall notify the department of any address or name change within thirty days of the change. Failure to timely notify the department of a name or address change may result in suspension of the permit for up to thirty days.

    (2) Agree in writing to hold harmless and indemnify the department, the state, or any peace officer for any and all liability arising out of the issuance or use of the concealed handgun permit.

    (3) Be a resident of the state and have been a resident for six months or longer immediately preceding the filing of the application.

    (4) Be twenty-one years of age or older.

    (5) Not suffer from a mental or physical infirmity due to disease, illness, or retardation which prevents the safe handling of a handgun.

    (6) Not be ineligible to possess a firearm by virtue of having been convicted of a felony.

    (7) Not have been committed, either voluntarily or involuntarily, for the abuse of a controlled dangerous substance, as defined by R.S. 40:961 and 964, or been found guilty of, or entered a plea of guilty or nolo contendere to a misdemeanor under the laws of this state or similar laws of any other state relating to a controlled dangerous substance within a five-year period immediately preceding the date on which the application is submitted, or be presently charged under indictment or a bill of information for such an offense.

    (8) Not chronically and habitually use alcoholic beverages to the extent that his normal faculties are impaired. It shall be presumed that an applicant or permittee chronically and habitually uses alcoholic beverages to the extent that his normal faculties are impaired if the applicant has been found guilty of, or entered a plea of guilty or nolo contendere to operating a vehicle while intoxicated, or has been admitted, either voluntarily or involuntarily, for treatment as an alcoholic, within the five-year period immediately preceding the date on which the application is submitted, or at any time after the application has been submitted.

    (9) Not have entered a plea of guilty or nolo contendere to or been found guilty of a crime of violence as defined in R.S. 14:2 at the misdemeanor level, unless five years have elapsed since completion of sentence or any other conditions set by the court have been fulfilled, or unless the conviction was set aside and the prosecution dismissed, prior to the date on which the application is submitted.

    (10) Not have been convicted of, have entered a plea of guilty or nolo contendere to, or not be charged under indictment or a bill of information for any crime of violence or any crime punishable by imprisonment for a term of one year or greater. A conviction, plea of guilty, or plea of nolo contendere under this Paragraph shall include an expungement of such conviction or a dismissal and conviction set-aside under the provisions of Code of Criminal Procedure Article 893. However, a person who has been convicted of a violation of 18 U.S.C. 491(a) shall be permitted to qualify for a concealed handgun permit if fifteen or more years has elapsed between the date of application and the successful completion or service of any sentence, deferred adjudication, or period of probation or parole.

    (11) Not be a fugitive from justice.

    (12) Not be an unlawful user of, or addicted to, marijuana, depressants, stimulants, or narcotic drugs.

    (13) Not have been adjudicated to be mentally deficient or been committed to a mental institution.

    (14) Not be an illegal alien in the United States.

    (15) Not have been discharged from the Armed Forces of the United States with a discharge characterized as "Under Other than Honorable Conditions", a "Bad Conduct Discharge", or a "Dishonorable Discharge". In the case of Commissioned Officers and Warrant Officers of the United States Armed Forces, the punishment of "Dismissal" rendered subject to a verdict of "guilty" at a trial by military court-martial is deemed to be disqualifying under this Paragraph. For the purposes of this Paragraph, the United States Coast Guard is considered an armed force.

    (16) Not have a history of engaging in violent behavior. There shall be a rebuttable presumption that an applicant has a history of engaging in violent behavior upon proof that, within a ten-year period immediately preceding the date of the application, the applicant has been arrested or charged on three or more occasions for any crime of violence as defined in R.S. 14:2(B), or has been arrested or charged on two or more occasions for any crime of violence that may be punished by death.

    (17) Not be ineligible to possess a firearm under 18 USC 922(g).

    (18) Not have had a permit denied within one year prior to the most recent application.

    (19) Not have had a permit revoked within four years prior to the most recent application.

    D.(1) In addition to the requirements of Subsection C of this Section, an applicant shall demonstrate competence with a handgun by any one of the following:

    (a) Completion of any National Rifle Association handguns safety or training course conducted by a National Rifle Association certified instructor within the preceding twelve months.

    (b) Completion of any Department of Public Safety and Corrections approved firearms safety or training course or class available to the general public offered by a law enforcement agency, college, or private or public institution or organization or firearms training school within the preceding twelve months.

    (c) Completion of any law enforcement firearms safety or training course or class approved by the Department of Public Safety and Corrections and offered for correctional officers, investigators, special deputies, or any division or subdivision of law enforcement or security enforcement within the preceding twelve months.

    (d) Possession of a current valid license to carry a concealed weapon issued by a parish law enforcement officer.

    (e) Completion of any firearms training or safety course or class approved by the Department of Public Safety and Corrections within the preceding twelve months.

    (f) Completion of a law enforcement training academy program certified by the Council on Peace Officer Standards and Training. However, any person retired from full-time service as a Louisiana peace officer need only demonstrate that he was properly certified by the Council on Peace Officer Standards and Training at the time of retirement.

    (g) Completion of small arms training within the preceding sixty months while serving with the armed forces of the United States as evidenced by any of the following:

    (i) For personnel released or retired from active duty, possession of an "Honorable Discharge" or "General Discharge Under Honorable Conditions" as evidenced by a Department of Defense Form 214 (DD-214).

    (ii) For personnel on active duty or serving in one of the National Guard or reserve components of the Armed Forces, possession of certification of completion of basic training with service record evidence of having successfully completed small arms training and qualification.

    (h) The National Rifle Association's personal protection course.

    (i) For personnel released or retired from active duty or the National Guard or reserve components of the Armed Forces for more than sixty months, possession of proof indicating combat service and an "Honorable Discharge" or "General Discharge Under Honorable Conditions" as evidenced by a Department of Defense Form 214 (DD-214) and completion of the following:

    (i) A three-hour course of instruction on the use of deadly force and conflict resolution which shall include a review of R.S. 14:18 through 22 and which may include a review of any other laws relating to the use of deadly force within the preceding sixty months.

    (ii) A one-hour course of instruction on child access prevention within the preceding sixty months.

    (2) Instructors for any class, training, or course of instruction authorized by this Subsection, except for small arms training in military service as provided in Subparagraph (1)(g) of this Subsection, shall be certified by the Council on Peace Officer Standards and Training as a firearms instructor or by the National Rifle Association as an instructor for Basic Pistol Shooting, Personal Protection in the Home, or Personal Protection Outside the Home. Any safety or training course or class as described in this Subsection, except for basic handgun training in military service provided in Subparagraph (1)(g) of this Subsection, shall include instruction in child access prevention.

    (3) Any live range fire training required to demonstrate competency as authorized by the provisions of this Subsection may use live ammunition or fixed-case marking projectiles capable of being fired from a handgun.

    E.(1) A photocopy of a certificate of completion of any of the courses or classes, or an affidavit from the instructor, school, club, organization, or group that conducted or taught said course or class attesting to the completion of the course or class by the applicant, or a copy of any document which shows completion of the course or class or confirms participation in firearms competition or honorable discharge shall constitute evidence of qualification pursuant to Subsection D of this Section.

    (2) It shall be illegal to intentionally present false, fraudulent, altered, or counterfeit documents to prove training in handguns in order to obtain a concealed handgun permit. Whoever intentionally presents false, fraudulent, altered, or counterfeit documents to prove training in handguns in order to obtain a concealed handgun permit shall be fined not more than one thousand dollars or imprisoned for not more than six months, or both. In addition, no person convicted of a violation of this Subsection shall be eligible to obtain a permit.

    F.(1) The deputy secretary shall revoke the permit if at any time during the permit period the permittee fails to satisfy any one of the qualification requirements provided for in Subsection C of this Section.

    (2) The deputy secretary shall revoke the permit for a violation of Subsection I of this Section or R.S. 40:1382.

    G. Neither the state, the deputy secretary of public safety services, nor any applicable permitting process employee of the Department of Public Safety and Corrections shall be liable for acts committed by the permittee, unless the deputy secretary or applicable permitting process employee had actual knowledge at the time the permit was issued that the permittee was disqualified by law from carrying a concealed handgun.

    H.(1) The deputy secretary of public safety services of the Department of Public Safety and Corrections shall, within two working days of the initial application, notify the chief of police of the municipality and the chief law enforcement officer of the parish in which the applicant is domiciled of such application. Those officers shall have ten days to forward to the deputy secretary any information relating to the applicant's legal qualification to receive a permit.

    (2) The deputy secretary of public safety services of the Department of Public Safety and Corrections shall issue timely and without delay the concealed handgun permit to all qualified applicants, which permit shall be for a term of five years, at a cost of twenty-five dollars per year, and which shall be valid in all parishes statewide. The division may promulgate rules for the purpose of providing for permits and fees for fewer than five years to the applicants requesting a shorter time period. Fees may be reduced proportionately for terms of fewer than five years. The permit shall be retained by the permittee who shall immediately produce it upon the request of any law enforcement officer.

    (3) Anyone who violates the provisions of this Subsection shall be fined not more than one hundred dollars.

    I.(1) No individual to whom a concealed handgun permit is issued may carry and conceal such handgun while under the influence of alcohol or a controlled dangerous substance. While a permittee is under the influence of alcohol or a controlled dangerous substance, an otherwise lawful permit is considered automatically suspended and is not valid. A permittee shall be considered under the influence as evidenced by a blood alcohol reading of .05 percent or greater by weight of alcohol in the blood, or when a blood test or urine test shows any confirmed presence of a controlled dangerous substance as defined in R.S. 40:961 and 964.

    (2) A permittee armed with a handgun in accordance with this Section shall notify any police officer who approaches the permittee in an official manner or with an identified official purpose that he has a weapon on his person, submit to a pat down, and allow the officer to temporarily disarm him. Whenever a law enforcement officer is made aware that an individual is carrying a concealed handgun and the law enforcement officer has reasonable grounds to believe that the individual is under the influence of either alcohol or a controlled dangerous substance, the law enforcement officer may take temporary possession of the handgun and request submission of the individual to a department certified chemical test for determination of the chemical status of the individual. Whenever a law enforcement officer is made aware that an individual is behaving in a criminally negligent manner as defined under the provisions of this Section, or is negligent in the carrying of a concealed handgun as provided for in R.S. 40:1382, the law enforcement officer may seize the handgun, until adjudication by a judge, if the individual is issued a summons or arrested under the provisions of R.S. 40:1382. Failure by the permittee to comply with the provisions of this Paragraph shall result in a six-month automatic suspension of the permit.

    (3) The permit to carry a concealed weapon shall be revoked by the deputy secretary when the permittee is carrying and concealing a handgun under any of the following circumstances:

    (a) The blood alcohol reading of a permittee is .05 percent or greater by weight of alcohol in the blood.

    (b) A permittee's blood test or urine test shows the confirmed presence of a controlled dangerous substance as defined in R.S. 40:961 and 964.

    (c) A permittee refuses to submit to a department-certified chemical test when requested to do so by a law enforcement officer pursuant to Paragraph (2) of this Subsection.

    (d) An individual is found guilty of negligent carrying of a concealed handgun as provided for in R.S. 40:1382.

    (4) The person tested may have a physician or a qualified technician, chemist, registered nurse, or other qualified person of his own choosing administer a chemical test or tests in addition to any administered at the direction of a law enforcement officer, and he shall be given the opportunity to telephone and request the qualified person to administer such test.

    (5) Whenever a peace officer determines that grounds under this Subsection exist for the revocation of a concealed handgun permit, he shall prepare an affidavit, on a form provided by the Department of Public Safety and Corrections, indicating the reasons for the revocation and all other information regarding the revocation available to the officer. A copy of the peace officer's report relating to the incident shall be attached to the affidavit when submitted to the department.

    J. For the purposes of this Section, the following terms shall have the meanings ascribed herein:

    (1) "Handgun" means a type of firearm commonly referred to as a pistol or revolver originally designed to be fired by the use of a single hand and which is designed to fire or is capable of firing fixed cartridge ammunition. The term "handgun" shall not include shotguns or rifles that have been altered by having their stocks or barrels cut or shortened.

    (2) "Criminal negligence" means there exists such disregard of the interest of others that the license holder's conduct amounts to a gross deviation below the standard of care expected to be maintained by a reasonably careful man under like circumstances.

    (3) "Resident" means a person who maintains a dwelling in this state and is physically present in this state at least fifty-one percent of each calendar year. However, a person who maintains a dwelling in this state but is not physically present in this state at least fifty-one percent of each calendar year is still considered to be a resident for purposes of this Section if he is on U.S. military duty in another state or is attending school in another state.

    (4) "Crime of violence" means a crime as defined in R.S. 14:2(B).

    K. The department shall execute a thorough background investigation, including a criminal history check, of every applicant for the purpose of verifying the qualifications of the applicant pursuant to the requirements of this Section. For purposes of this Subsection, a background check shall be defined as a computer check of available on-line state records, and, if warranted, the fingerprints may be forwarded to the Federal Bureau of Investigation for a national criminal history record check.

    L. Anyone who carries and conceals a handgun in violation of any provision of this Section, unless authorized to do so by another provision of the law, shall be fined not more than five hundred dollars, or imprisoned for not more than six months, or both.

    M. No concealed handgun permit shall be valid or entitle any permittee to carry a concealed weapon in any facility, building, location, zone, or area in which firearms are banned by state or federal law.

    N. No concealed handgun may be carried into and no concealed handgun permit issued pursuant to this Section shall authorize or entitle a permittee to carry a concealed handgun in any of the following:

    (1) A law enforcement office, station, or building.

    (2) A detention facility, prison, or jail.

    (3) A courthouse or courtroom, provided that a judge may carry such a weapon in his own courtroom.

    (4) A polling place.

    (5) A meeting place of the governing authority of a political subdivision.

    (6) The state capitol building.

    (7) Any portion of an airport facility where the carrying of firearms is prohibited under federal law, except that no person shall be prohibited from carrying any legal firearm into the terminal, if the firearm is encased for shipment, for the purpose of checking such firearm as lawful baggage.

    (8) Any church, synagogue, mosque, or other similar place of worship, eligible for qualification as a tax-exempt organization under 26 U.S.C. 501, except as provided for in Subsection U of this Section.

    (9) A parade or demonstration for which a permit is issued by a governmental entity.

    (10) Any portion of the permitted area of an establishment that has been granted a Class A-General retail permit, as defined in Part II of Chapter 1 or Part II of Chapter 2 of Title 26 of the Louisiana Revised Statutes of 1950, to sell alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premises.

    (11) Any school, school campus, or school bus as defined in R.S. 14:95.6.

    O. The provisions of Subsection N of this Section shall not limit the right of a property owner, lessee, or other lawful custodian to prohibit or restrict access of those persons possessing a concealed handgun pursuant to a permit issued under this Section. No individual to whom a concealed handgun permit is issued may carry such concealed handgun into the private residence of another without first receiving the consent of that person.

    P. Within three months of April 19, 1996, the Department of Public Safety and Corrections shall promulgate rules and regulations in accordance with the Administrative Procedure Act to provide an appeal process in the event that an applicant is denied issuance of a permit. The department may also promulgate educational requirements for renewal of concealed handgun permits.

    Q. The provisions of this Section shall not apply to commissioned law enforcement officers.

    R.(1) Each permittee, within fifteen days of a misdemeanor or a felony arrest, other than a minor traffic violation, in this state or any other state, shall notify the deputy secretary of public safety services by certified mail. The deputy secretary may suspend, for up to ninety days, the permit of any permittee who fails to meet the notification requirements of this Section.

    (2) The Department of Public Safety and Corrections shall submit a report by March thirty-first of each year to the Senate Committee on Judiciary C and the House Committee on the Administration of Criminal Justice relative to concealed handgun permits. The report shall include information on the number of licenses issued, denied, revoked, or suspended and the reasons for such denial, revocation, or suspension to be categorized by age, sex, race, and zip code of the applicant or licensee. The report shall include data concerning any known accidents or deaths involving permittees.

    S. Notwithstanding any other provision of law to the contrary, the department may develop, print, and distribute an informational newsletter relative to concealed handgun permittees, safety training, and related matters.

    T.(1) Possession of a current and valid concealed handgun permit issued pursuant to this Section shall constitute sufficient evidence of the background check required pursuant to 18 U.S.C. 922(t).

    (2) A current and valid concealed handgun permit issued by another state to an individual having attained the age of twenty-one years shall be deemed to be valid for the out-of-state permit holder to carry a concealed weapon within this state if a current and valid concealed handgun permit issued by Louisiana is valid in those states.

    (3) An out-of-state permit holder carrying a concealed handgun pursuant to this Paragraph is bound by the laws of this state regarding carrying a concealed handgun pursuant to a permit issued in accordance with this Section.

    (4) A concealed handgun permit issued by another state is invalid in the state of Louisiana for the purpose of authorizing a Louisiana resident to carry a concealed handgun in the state of Louisiana.

    (5) The deputy secretary for public safety services shall also have the authority to enter into reciprocity agreements with other states so that full-time active peace officers commissioned in another state shall have the same authority as a person issued a concealed handgun permit pursuant to this Section to carry a concealed handgun while in this state, regardless of whether or not they are in the official discharge of their duties, and full-time active law enforcement officers commissioned in this state shall have the authority to carry a concealed handgun in those states whether or not they are in the official discharge of their duties. An out-of-state law enforcement officer carrying a concealed handgun pursuant to this Paragraph is bound by the laws of this state regarding carrying a concealed handgun pursuant to a permit issued in accordance with this Section.

    U.(1) The entity which owns the business or has authority over the administration of a church, synagogue, or mosque shall have the authority to authorize any person issued a valid concealed handgun permit as authorized by the provisions of this Section to carry a concealed handgun in the church, synagogue, or mosque.

    (2) The provisions of this Subsection shall not be construed to limit or prohibit any church, synagogue, or mosque from employing armed security guards who are either certified law enforcement officers or who are authorized to carry concealed handguns pursuant to the provisions of this Section.

    (3) If the church, synagogue, or mosque authorizes the carrying of concealed handguns as authorized by the provisions of this Subsection, the pastor, priest, minister, or other authority of the church, synagogue, or mosque shall inform the congregation of the authorization.

    (4) The provisions of this Section shall not be construed to authorize the carrying of a concealed handgun in a church, synagogue, or mosque located on the property of any school or school property, which would otherwise be prohibited by the provisions of R.S. 14:95.2.

    (5) Any church, synagogue, or mosque authorizing the carrying of concealed handguns pursuant to the provisions of this Subsection shall require an additional eight hour tactical training for those persons wishing to carry concealed handguns in the church, synagogue, or mosque. The training shall be conducted annually.








    So with that being said, I am NOT an Attorney and I cannot provide legal advise, just make sure before you do anything that might give you problems down the road that you are standing on solid legal grounds.
     

    Yrdawg

    *Banned*
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    Sep 24, 2006
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    Big Woods
    IANAL...I do believe that carrying in your car where prohibted on private property is not illegal but if told to leave you could be subject to trespass or remaining ??

    If I work for a refinery who has a no guns in car policy and I have a gun in car, I can be disciplined by the company, not prosecuted under the law ??
     

    tea333

    Dysfunctional Vet
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    Jan 25, 2009
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    Shreveport, LA
    I work for the Fed. Gov't. No firearms/weapons allowed on Gov't property - period. I asked if I could get my own gun locker but was refused. 5 days a week to, from and at work I cannot carry a firearm, even in my vehicle. Some coworkers do carry in their vehicles but I won't take the chance of being fired then going to court.
     

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