Lancer L5 AWM vs. PMAG...might be dumping all my lancers (Dumped my Noveske instead)

[SpeedRacer]

Yeah...good luck sleeping once that things arrives.

ETA: actually...making them send you a pic of the blem upper cancels out the fact that you ordered a blem upper.

 

[JWG223]

Yeah...good luck sleeping once that things arrives.

ETA: actually...making them send you a pic of the blem upper cancels out the fact that you ordered a blem upper.

It's the only 7" vis noveske has or will have in a loooonnnnng time. Non-chainsaw, and I had zero options if I wanted that upper.
They sat on my order for 9 weeks and I finally figured out what was up and they were nice enough to turn the place upside down to find that for me. Notice they deleted all of them from their website. Vltor is at the mercy of the parent company, and supply from them is always iffy.

 

[Vermiform]

I have 12 of the newer 30 round Lancer mags and they all function fine in my AK.

 

[SpeedRacer]

Ya know, this discussion is reminding me mightily of a time, during a BayouShooter lunch/meet, when a certain former prolific member was justifying his choice of a "piston" AR over the time-honored DI iteration. When pressed to tell me WHY it was "better"... for OUR situation here in south Louisiana, NOT 10K miles away in a different climate... the best he could come up with was, "It recoils less."

Oh. Right.

.

Steve, I believe the correct term was "recoil impulse".

 

[J-Dog]

Well, I decided to be rough with a Magpul and a Lancer AWM. Hands down, the Magpul was WAY! tougher. I beat the hell out of the back of the upper part of the mag where the feed-lips join the body. Then I turned it face-bown in a beer-can grip and slammed it repeatedly. All of this into the end of a 25# dumbell in my living-room. After say, 10 or so whacks in each orientation, I was rewarded with about a 1mm crack at a 45* angle from the left feed-lip where it joins the mag-body on the inside of the "V" at follower-height.

Well...that sucks...Lets try an AWM...

After 3 whacks the metal feed lips totally failed. The back of them where it wraps around the mag just broke in two like cheap pop-metal.

Guess which one will still work in a weapon?

This was far from scientific, just using my hands to grab the mag and beat it against the dumbell and all, really cave-man-like, but it did show me that those metal feed-lips on the AWM were not as impressive as I first though, and that that product can and will also fail. Gratuitous pic, although one cannot see the crack in the PMAG. I have to pry at the feed-lips to see it, and I bet it would still perform 100%. Not so much, the AWM.

This is not to say that either mag is junk, or bad, but just that both can and will fail if you bang them around the right way, step on them, drop them fully loaded onto concrete, or whatever.

I don't know if the AWM cracked on the first or third hit, I stopped when it sounded and felt "funny". Same for the PMAG, I think it did it when I inverted it and began slamming the feed-lips into the dumbell, though, if I had to guess.

Just wondering where you shoot that would subject your gear to hostile enviornment?

 

[Richard in LA]

I wasn't there, but I thought the comment was something along the lines of "It makes the recoil feel like a .22"?

 

[JWG223]

Just wondering where you shoot that would subject your gear to hostile enviornment?

I wouldn't, but my point was that PMAG's and AWM's alike are breakable. The PMAG feeds better for me, and you're right, I usually don't bang stuff around.

 

[JWG223]

I wasn't there, but I thought the comment was something along the lines of "It makes the recoil feel like a .22"?

A piston conversion? I had always heard they had more felt recoil, especially the HK416 with its faster BCG movement.

 

[Richard in LA]

A piston conversion? I had always heard they had more felt recoil, especially the HK416 with its faster BCG movement.

I have no experience with piston conversion guns, I was just recalling the story I was told about the conversation centered around one members conversion kit and how it makes it shoot softer.

 

[Hey]

Bro if you wanna go out an spend a bunch of money on new mags, it's your money spend it. Coming up with stupid unrealistic test to validate yourself is silly.

Makes for a good thread; it's his money, and you loose nothing. Why not?

 

[Leonidas]

We need fire at some point in the test. When you have to clear your house & it is burning it will be too late to figure out which mag can't take the heat. Technically what is needed is heat but I digress. Light one on fire using an 'accelerant' and then shoot controlled pairs while filming it. Then repeat with the other mag. People will find fault with your methods but don't worry it will make great video. To avoid some nitpicking make sure the 'accelerant' is use in equal amount and in the same distribution on the mags. Try to track ambient temp.

That's one for the history books.

 

[dixiejarhead]

I am sure of the cause of the failure I had this weekend. The feed lips dig into the rounds, have no flex, and the bolt release actuated reload failed. Pmags don't have as much "bite" and work better in this area. Lancer already redesigned the feed lips once because of this issue.

You are correct sir. Pmags will fail as well as will any magazine - we have to inspect them routinely and disgard any that have signs of excessive wear. The pmag feed lip design is very good and it does flex a little which in my experiance enhances reliability. On a pistol, I prefer metal feed lips. On my M4 I prefer polymer.

 

[JWG223]

You are correct sir. Pmags will fail as well as will any magazine - we have to inspect them routinely and disgard any that have signs of excessive wear. The pmag feed lip design is very good and it does flex a little which in my experiance enhances reliability. On a pistol, I prefer metal feed lips. On my M4 I prefer polymer.

I like that if a PMAG is on its way out, you can physically see it. With a metal magazine, a little tweak may go un-noticed. I still remember the hell people went through trying to "fix" pre-ban USGI stuff during the ban years.

 

[dixiejarhead]

I like that if a PMAG is on its way out, you can physically see it. With a metal magazine, a little tweak may go un-noticed. I still remember the hell people went through trying to "fix" pre-ban USGI stuff during the ban years.

Indeed! I remember deadlining hundreds of the old USGI aluminum ones back in the day.... Cracked or bent feed lip, drop to floor, heavy combat boot heel to the mag, discard into recycling bin....

PMAGs are the best buy for the buck out there for a reliable combat ready magazine hands down. My opinion of course, which I'm certain many here will discount lol!

 

[Vanilla Gorilla]

Not true man lots of PMAGs have feed lips that have flexed out of spec and they look fine.

 

[dixiejarhead]

Not true man lots of PMAGs have feed lips that have flexed out of spec and they look fine.

So when you find a bad one, you mark it bad and discard it. That is the problem with us gun people, we just can't stand to throw a magazine away! Even if it's broken! lol!

 

[Vanilla Gorilla]

Might be a problem for you, I throw em away.

 

[dixiejarhead]

Might be a problem for you, I throw em away.

My post was in jest....

 

[goteron]

There are so many PMAG's out there its insane, not nearly as many as GI, but still a lot. Lancer doesnt have nearly the volume.

Either works fine.

Also, don't throw your PMAGs away. When you have about 10 bad ones, call up Magpul and get 10 new mags free. They have unparalled CS.

I like PMAG's because they just work well, if I lived in extremely cold temperatures I would have GI only. The lancers work well too, I just have 50 + PMAG's and dont need anymore.

Don't overanalyze, just shoot. Though I do believe Magpul has spent more money in R&D than any other mag in existence. THey have a bright bunch of engineers over there, and the M3 is probably as good as it gets (I would be removing the over-insertion stops though, I don't know why they put those in.

 

[returningliberty]

There are so many PMAG's out there its insane, not nearly as many as GI, but still a lot. Lancer doesnt have nearly the volume.

Either works fine.

Also, don't throw your PMAGs away. When you have about 10 bad ones, call up Magpul and get 10 new mags free. They have unparalled CS.

I like PMAG's because they just work well, if I lived in extremely cold temperatures I would have GI only. The lancers work well too, I just have 50 + PMAG's and dont need anymore.

Don't overanalyze, just shoot. Though I do believe Magpul has spent more money in R&D than any other mag in existence. THey have a bright bunch of engineers over there, and the M3 is probably as good as it gets (I would be removing the over-insertion stops though, I don't know why they put those in.

Maybe for the 249? I never had one, but apparently you could really jam a GI mag in there.