Legal Landmine in Lake Charles-carry in places selling alcohol

[sraacke]

We are all aware of the issues regarding carry in places which sell alcohol for on site consumption. TGIFridays, Hooters, etc.
What about gas stations or even Walmart? Well, in most cases the answer would be, Carry on since those places don't let you drink on site. What you may have overlooked are local ordinances which are buried where most people might miss them and could potentially cause you legal troubles. Did you know that in Lake Charles you are not allowed to carry your firearm or other weapon anywhere that sells alcohol, wether they allow on site consumption or not?
http://library.municode.com/HTML/14...NPR_ARTIINGE_S13-28.1SALLCAWEESWHALBEARSOPEVI

Sec. 13-28.1. - Same—Illegal carrying of weapons in an establishment where alcoholic beverages are sold and penalties for violation.

(a)
Illegal carrying of weapon in business establishment where alcoholic beverages are sold is:

(1)
The intentional possession of any firearm or other instrumentality, customarily used or intended for probable use as a dangerous weapon, on one's person, in an establishment where alcoholic beverages are sold;

(2)
The possession, custody or use of a switchblade knife, spring knife, or other knife, or similar instrument having a blade which may be automatically unfolded or extended from a handle by the manipulation of a button, switch, latch or similar contrivance, or any knife with a blade in excess of four inches, in an establishment where alcoholic beverages are sold.

(b)
Definitions.

(1)
The words "business establishment," within the meaning of this section, shall be deemed to be any structure located upon real estate, which is used for the sale of alcoholic beverages, as defined herein, to any person.

(2)
The words "alcoholic beverages," as used in this section, shall have the meaning given in R.S. 26:241(1).

(c)
Whoever commits the offense of illegal carrying of weapons in an establishment where alcoholic beverages are sold shall be imprisoned for not less than five days and not more than six months, and may be fined not more than $500.00.

Cross reference— Alcoholic beverages, Ch. 3.

(d)
The provisions of this section shall not apply to sheriffs and their deputies, state and city police, constables and marshals or persons vested with police power when in the actual discharge of their official duties, as well as to the operator of the business establishment.

Beware of legal landmines.
I bring this up in hope that members here as well as groups such as LSA and even LOCAL can work together toward having this local code modified or removed so that gun owners who carry (concealed or openly) will not face arrest or other problems when going about thier business.

 

[jmcrawf1]

Isnt there something somewhere about local ordinances not being more restrictive than state law?

 

[Ben Segrest]

Isnt there something somewhere about local ordinances not being more restrictive than state law?

It's called preemption and prevents any new laws from being more restrictive than state laws. Thus, it all depends on when the quoted law was enacted.

 

[Leadfoot]

Also, there's a little thing called intent.

 

[Yrdawg]

and theres north LC and theres south LC, same city but not even close

I have carried in and around LC for years with out problem...but then I'm very much Concealed is ...you know

 

[sraacke]

Also, there's a little thing called intent.

So the arguement would be, "Sorry Officer. I didn't intend to carry this gun into the gas station when I came in to pay for my gas"? I don't see that working out so well.

 

[Specularius]

as was stated, When was this ordinance passed?

 

[Leadfoot]

So the arguement would be, "Sorry Officer. I didn't intend to carry this gun into the gas station when I came in to pay for my gas"? I don't see that working out so well.

No, not in the least and you know better.

If you're a goon, being suspicious, acting an ass in the gas station, I can see an officer charging you under this ordinance.

However, if you are CHP holder, minding your own business, and was unaware of the ordinance, and not in the process of committing some other crime, I don't see it being an issue.

 

[oleheat]

So has anyone heard of someone getting pinched for carrying in one of these places over there?

 

[Specularius]

Sec 13-29.1 Laser Lighting Devices
(a)It shall be unlawful for any person under the age of 21 to possess a laser lighting device except in the residence of that person.
(b)It shall be unlawful for any person to sell, offer to sell, lease, give or otherwise provide a laser lighting device to any person under the age of 21.
(c)It shall be unlawful for any person to shine, point, or focus a laser lighting device, directly or indirectly, upon another person or upon an animal.
(d)It shall be unlawful for any person to use a laser lighting device in such a manner that the laser beam illuminates the operator of a motor vehicle.
(e)For purposes of this section, a "laser lighting device" means a hand-held device which emits a laser light beam that is designed to be used by the operator as a pointer or highlighter to indicate, mark, or identify a specific position, place, item or object.

This one got my attention!!!!

You can go to jail for giving your kid a laser pointer!!!!!

 

[Yrdawg]

So has anyone heard of someone getting pinched for carrying in one of these places over there?

Nope...one real good source would be Matthew Courtney, he posts on GT. He is a CWP instructor and well in the know on local stuff. I am there often and see their news, have not seen such in the 9 years I have my CHP, this was not discussed in any CHP classes or renewals. Only state law, seems to me like most people are under the pre emption idea

 

[Specularius]

Clearly LC needs to update it's ordinances as it does not give an exemption for CHP licenses at all anywhere in the ordinace.

 

[JBE]

If I'm not mistaken, this ordinance was in place before the current state CC laws were enacted....

 

[vern10mm]

No, not in the least and you know better.

If you're a goon, being suspicious, acting an ass in the gas station, I can see an officer charging you under this ordinance.

However, if you are CHP holder, minding your own business, and was unaware of the ordinance, and not in the process of committing some other crime, I don't see it being an issue.

I think you might be confusing officer discretion with the law. "not being an issue" does not make it legal.

Secondly, intent has nothing to do with this unless the law says "with intent".

You can. Accidentally commit a crime with no intent.

 

[Leadfoot]

You sure showed me.

 

[Tim67]

No, not in the least and you know better.

If you're a goon, being suspicious, acting an ass in the gas station, I can see an officer charging you under this ordinance.

However, if you are CHP holder, minding your own business, and was unaware of the ordinance, and not in the process of committing some other crime, I don't see it being an issue.

It would also depend on the temperment of the DA. He could be chomping at the bit to "get guns off the street" or he could curse the officer for bringing him chicken$#!t.

 

[oleheat]

Nope...one real good source would be Matthew Courtney, he posts on GT. He is a CWP instructor and well in the know on local stuff. I am there often and see their news, have not seen such in the 9 years I have my CHP, this was not discussed in any CHP classes or renewals. Only state law, seems to me like most people are under the pre emption idea

You would have thought that it would have happened by now if this is the case. If it would have, the CHP holder would have likely cried foul- loudly.

 

[Pace]

I'm no lawyer, but it looks preempted (1994). Also, if you are Legally carrying (concealed with CHP) or OC (Article 1 Section 11), then you are NOT carrying Illegally. (If you can own a firearm and or obtain a CHP to begin with).

PS: The LASER is my indoor cat's favorite thing!


Sec. 13-28. - Weapons—Illegally carrying.

(a)
Illegal carrying of a weapon is:
(1)
The intentional concealment of any firearm, or other instrumentality customarily used or intended for probable use as a dangerous weapon, on one's person; or
(2)
The ownership, possession, custody or use of any firearm, or other instrumentality customarily used as a dangerous weapon, at any time by an enemy alien; or
(3)
The ownership, possession, custody or use of any tools, or dynamite, or nitroglycerine, or explosives, or other instrumentality customarily used by thieves or burglars at any time by any person with the intent to commit a crime; or
(4)
The manufacture, ownership, possession, custody or use of any switchblade knife, spring knife or other knife or similar instrument having a blade which may be automatically unfolded or extended from a handle by the manipulation of a button, switch, latch or similar contrivance.
(5)a.
The intentional possession or use by any person of a dangerous weapon on a school campus during regular school hours or on a school bus. "School" means any elementary, secondary, high school, or vo-tech school in this state and "campus" means all facilities and property within the boundary of the school property. "School bus" means any motor bus being used to transport children to and from school or in connection with school activities.
b.
The provisions of this paragraph shall not apply to:
(i)
A state or local law enforcement officer in the performance of his official duties;
(ii)
A school official or employee acting during the normal course of his employment or a student acting under the direction of such school official or employee;
(iii)
Any person having the written permission of the principal or school board and engaged in competition or in marksmanship or safety instruction.
(b)
Whoever commits the offense of illegal carrying of a weapon shall be punished as provided in section 1-8.
(c)
The provisions of this section except paragraph (4) of subsection (a) shall not apply to sheriffs and their deputies, state and city police, constables and marshals, or persons vested with police power when in the actual discharge of official duties.
(Code 1956, § 16-28; Ord. No. 10334, § 7, 12-21-94)

 

[charlie12]

If I'm not mistaken, this ordinance was in place before the current state CC laws were enacted....

I don't think it would matter about when the CHP became state wide it would be the preemption for the ordinance

 

[sraacke]

How do we tell if it was on the books before state preemption? At the bottom it has... (Ord. No. 6443, § 1, 11-7-79; Ord. No. 7592, § 4, 4-20-83) So this means it was there in 1979 and updated in 1983? ????