Mental Illness Control?

[tim9lives]

Two of the problems about convicted felons are that there are some felonies that should be misdemeanors and there are some felonies that should be capital but aren't. Anyone who is free at all should be truly free. Anyone (criminally) not fit to be free should be incarcerated or executed.
IMO, the problem is that social issues which should have been left in the hands of health care professions ( addiction ) have been turned into criminal acts. Alcohol abuse was not solved with the 18th amendment which prohibited the manufacture and consumption of alcohol. The end result of prohibition was an increase in crime.
The same thing is what is wrong today in America IMO.The status quo is not working. Crime is much higher than it was 40 years ago and we are going broke locking up millions of Americans.
"Justice is harsher in America than in any other rich country. Between 2.3m and 2.4m Americans are behind bars, roughly one in every 100 adults."
Too many laws, Too many prisoners --http://thepragmaticprogressive.blogspot.com/2010/08/us-prison-population-explodes.html

 

[Yrdawg]

Two of the problems about convicted felons are that there are some felonies that should be misdemeanors and there are some felonies that should be capital but aren't. Anyone who is free at all should be truly free. Anyone (criminally) not fit to be free should be incarcerated or executed.
IMO, the problem is that social issues which should have been left in the hands of health care professions ( addiction ) have been turned into criminal acts. Alcohol abuse was not solved with the 18th amendment which prohibited the manufacture and consumption of alcohol. The end result of prohibition was an increase in crime.
The same thing is what is wrong today in America IMO.The status quo is not working. Crime is much higher than it was 40 years ago and we are going broke locking up millions of Americans.
"Justice is harsher in America than in any other rich country. Between 2.3m and 2.4m Americans are behind bars, roughly one in every 100 adults."
Too many laws, Too many prisoners --http://thepragmaticprogressive.blogspot.com/2010/08/us-prison-population-explodes.html

FTW here...

Legalizing dope would go a long way toward cleaning the jails, gene pool and medicare rolls of non violent offenders who cost taxpayers a bundle

Some learning curve to be sure but probably a short one...

 

[tim9lives]

I firmly believe that the current "Drug War" ( modern prohibition IMO) has caused the increase in crime and criminal gangs. Most of this crime is related to the cost of the drugs. And it is only getting worse IMO. Furthermore, something is really out of whack when a 16 year old can buy crack or weed easier than they can get cigarettes or bear.
*When I was a teenager in the 70's, weed was the main "drug" that was around. And for that matter it was rare to see someone under 18 who had it. Dealers (hippies as I remember) rarely *sold to juveniles because they were scared to death of the law. Selling to underage juveniles was taboo.*
**So in the last 40 years we have spent billions if not trillions of dollars fighting and incarcerating thousands of individuals with very poor results IMO. Crime has increased while jails are all overcrowded.
Children are now the dealers because they get an "all clear" once they turn 18. It's just a mess IMO.
*I'll add that now the silly kids are snorting bath salts & smoking synthetic "herb" that is probably so harmful it should be listed as Hazardous Waste with the DEQ.*
*Anyway, I really think that the responsibilities should shift to the medical professionals when dealing with non violent drug users. Drug abuse in and of itself should not be a criminal act. Let the hard core addicts visit the public health doctor, get a Rx and get their fix at a pharmacy. Every month they would repeat this at a very low cost. They would not have to sell drugs to support their habit. They would not be selling drugs to my nieces and nephews. Since it would no longer be the "forbidden fruit," I think drug use would actually decline. And health care professionals would be dealing with the drug problem which is a health issue. (Not the police) The police would then be able to concentrate on violent crime. *
*I only brought this up to get people to think. I am not advocating legalization of all drugs. I am advocating an honest discussion in America for another answer than the status quo. Maybe decriminalization would work.*

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukn...-says-former-Labour-Home-Office-minister.html

 

[tea333]

If a person is admitted to the hospital, say for a medical or psychiatric problem, and he/she is found to be homicidal/suicidal or gravely ill then the doctor admits this patient under a Physicians Emergency Commitment (PEC). The hospital then notifies the Coroner's Office of the PEC. The Coroner then comes to the hospital to interview the patient. If the Coroner agrees with the PEC then they commit the patient under a Coroner's Emergency Commitment (CEC). If a person appears unstable at home or anywhere outside a hospital setting and is homicidal, suicidal or gravely ill you have to go to the Coroner's Office and fill out the necessary paperwork and if the Coroner agrees then a CEC is issued, taken to the police department and the mentally ill person is picked up by the local police and taken to the hospital of your choice. A Judical Commitment is difficult and time consuming to get. I am not part of that process so cannot give any particulars on how it is done. At one time I contacted several different attorneys about having a family member Judicially Committed and was told that this is usually a long and generally a difficult process. I did not find an attorney who would take this on. I would think that a patient who is admitted to a hospital, be it a psychiatric hospital or regular hospital, under aa PEC or CEC then that informtion should be shared with the local law enforcement agencies and a notation placed in their police record. When a background check is done on this person this information should show up and that person not be allowed to purchase or own a firearm.

The family member I referred to has good days and bad days with respect to her mental status. She was diagnosed as a paranoid schizophrenic with multiple voluntary and involuntary admits over the years. On her good days she "appears" just another normal looking customer out to purchase a firearm and could walk into a gun shop and as far as I know could lie about the mental illness thing and purchase a firearm. If I am wrong about this please let me know. Every now and then she will call me and ask if I will loan her a handgun or take her to a gun store so she could purchase her own. That is something I will never do for her. She gets pissed at me and I don't hear from her for a while. This family member does not do illegal drugs, though she is on many prescribed psychiatric medication, does not drink alcohol, has never been in jail and before her illness manifested itself to those around her she held down a good, well paying job. How much sharing of this type of medical information is there between the city and state police with any federal agencies?

 

[Cat]

I understand your concern, but by saying that you believe the PEC procedure should be noted on everyone and they shouldn't purchase a firearm, you are judging every mental illness based on your family member.

People are incapacitated and suffer nervous and mental break downs due to severe and personal emotional trauma. This lands them in a hospital because they are a danger to themselves. Time and counseling heals the person and layer, they return to normal.

They should never be able to purchase a firearm again? Not every person that has been hospitalized is a danger. Situations vary widely which is why You are required to submit medical explanations. While your family member shouldn't own a firearm, a man I know spent six months in a mental institution after his only son was killed by negligent homicide. Twenty years later he is a contributing member of society.

 

[leVieux]

"will this lead to people not seeking help and treatment for mental issues for fear that there will be negative consequences?Absolutely

Basically, in order to implement this you would need a doctor who has the power to determine (based upon his opinion) whether you can exercise a constitutional right. I guess if that would be lawful, perhaps we could have a law passed where I get to decide who can exercise their 1st amendment rights based upon my opinion of the potential stupidity that may be spoken.

As a long-time physician and medical educator, I can say with great confidence that physicians are not qualified to do this; and, should never be given such power, which would soon be corrupted.

There are more leftist, statist physicians than there are unethical judges.

leVieux

 

[Summit_Ace]

Unless you were institutionalized by the court, your records should never be available to any government agency. What you say in a doctor's office is between you and your doctor, and nobody else.

If one in a million people who buys a gun slips through the safety net......OH WELL.

He who sacrifices freedom for security deserves neither?

I believe this is how I feel also. I also happen to think there is a strong difference between voluntary and involuntary commitment. There are individuals who are proactive in recognizing their mental illness and make a point to have a strong support system in place.

Unfortunately this is not always the case at least not in the state of LA if you choose to carry concealed.

 

[PrairieCajun]

Baton Rouge has a HUGE problem with mentally ill citizens and no place for them. Govt. is tapped out and private pay care is not happening. This city and its officers/other businesses deal with them regularly. Until we have this country back on track fiscally, we will deal with it the hard way.

 

[penguin]

Neither a PEC nor CEC are a a bar from purchasing a firearm in La. Jurisprudence on the matter is clear that neither a PEC nor CEC are 'commitments'; how a PEC or CEC effects a CHL I do not know.

 

[sandman7925]

Two of the problems about convicted felons are that there are some felonies that should be misdemeanors and there are some felonies that should be capital but aren't. Anyone who is free at all should be truly free. Anyone (criminally) not fit to be free should be incarcerated or executed.

Well put. If they are free then they have payed their debt.

 

[sraacke]

Baton Rouge has a HUGE problem with mentally ill citizens and no place for them. Govt. is tapped out and private pay care is not happening. This city and its officers/other businesses deal with them regularly. Until we have this country back on track fiscally, we will deal with it the hard way.

Believe me. I know what you are talking about. It's not uncommon to have PECs taking up 3, 4, 5, even 6 beds a night in our ER in Midcity. Some are there for only 12 hours and others are there for DAYS waiting for placement. I swear, sometimes I think if it weren't for the PEC transfers Acadian Ambulance and Reliant Transportation wouldn't have half the business they have.

 

[themcfarland]

I have mental illness in my wife's family. Her dad was an undocumented paranoid schizo both audible and visual , her bro got the schizoid personality disorder.. basically he is 50 something and never left home after getting a masters.
he is an ASS! and when I was young, he would have been the one who should have been beaten into shape and should have been..

The father had a few guns, and never hurt a soul with them.
The brother as pissed off as he is, knew where the guns were and didnt hurt anyone..
the father died of Alzheimers and the brother is now on disability, but still I would not have removed their ability to have a gun.. it is a right, not a privilege. Now if they are on the streets, still let them, they have the right to defend themselves as well.. IF they are not felons..

 

[oleheat]

Although I have never intentionally killed anyone with a spoon....it sounds VERY labor intensive....

Not if they sharpen the handle.....

 

[CAJUNLAWYER]

which is why one should always fight institutionalization and insist instead on outpatient treatment