Want to build an AR pistol

[4x4demon]

When building an AR pistol is it as simple as buying a pistol lower and then a short barreled upper?

 

[bravo3]

as far as legalities go? yeah

a "pistol lower" is no different than a rifle lower, just the buffer tube is different

 

[4x4demon]

Thanks, I didnt know if there was anything to do with ordering the 11" upper since I could easily slap it on a regular lower with only my good word being the only thing stopping me.

 

[bravo3]

Thanks, I didnt know if there was anything to do with ordering the 11" upper since I could easily slap it on a regular lower with only my good word being the only thing stopping me.

Yeah, lol, just don't

 

[4x4demon]

Wasnt planning on it. Lol, thanks though.

 

[jgreco15]

as far as legalities go? yeah

a "pistol lower" is no different than a rifle lower, just the buffer tube is different

"Once a rifle, always a rifle." The OP needs to find a "virgin" lower or a lower that has not been classified as a rifle to do his AR pistol build. Taking a rifle lower and just removing the stock to add a pistol buffer tube will not be acceptable (in the eyes of the ATF) without paying a $200 tax and filing the correct paperwork (SBR). OP, please do your own research on the subject and do not listen to other people on the internet for legal advice.

 

[Booseman]

"Once a rifle, always a rifle." The OP needs to find a "virgin" lower or a lower that has not been classified as a rifle to do his AR pistol build. Taking a rifle lower and just removing the stock to add a pistol buffer tube will not be acceptable (in the eyes of the ATF) without paying a $200 tax and filing the correct paperwork (SBR). OP, please do your own research on the subject and do not listen to other people on the internet for legal advice.

Correct me if I am wrong jgreco, but can he not use a stripped lower since it has never been assembled into anything?

 

[bravo3]

"Once a rifle, always a rifle." The OP needs to find a "virgin" lower or a lower that has not been classified as a rifle to do his AR pistol build. Taking a rifle lower and just removing the stock to add a pistol buffer tube will not be acceptable (in the eyes of the ATF) without paying a $200 tax and filing the correct paperwork (SBR). OP, please do your own research on the subject and do not listen to other people on the internet for legal advice.

I didn't misdirect him, he said "buying a pistol lower" hence, buying a lower for the pistol.

 

[troy_mclure]

When picking up a lower from your ffl just ask them to list it as other or handgun on the 4473, gtg.

 

[4x4demon]

I was going to buy one of the pistol lowers already classified as a pistol. I was not planning on taking a regular rifle lower and putting an 11" upper on it. Im not stamped for that.

 

[jgreco15]

Correct me if I am wrong jgreco, but can he not use a stripped lower since it has never been assembled into anything?

Yes he can. It doesn't necessarily have to be "stripped" though. It can be a complete pistol lower. As long as it isn't a rifle lower.

I didn't misdirect him, he said "buying a pistol lower" hence, buying a lower for the pistol.

I was just making sure he didn't take his rifle lower and convert it into a pistol by simply changing the buffer tube. The way I read the first few comments in this thread, I thought that was what was being discussed. Sorry if I misunderstood what was going on. Wasn't trying to be a dick.

I was going to buy one of the pistol lowers already classified as a pistol. I was not planning on taking a regular rifle lower and putting an 11" upper on it. Im not stamped for that.

Again, sorry if I jumped in here if my comments were unnecessary. I thought you were asking if you could put a pistol buffer tube on your rifle lower and install the 11" upper. When I saw that (or thought I saw that) I wanted to warn you.

 

[4x4demon]

Id rather be warned unnecessarily than not warned and get in trouble.

 

[whitsend]

Read these.

http://www.atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2011-4.pdf
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_6_50/348908_ATF__pistol_to_rifle_to_pistol_is_legal.html

Stripped lower are listed as "Other" on 4473.
If you first build it as a pistol, then you can go to rifle and back to a pistol.
If you first build it as a rifle, then you can NOT go to a pistol.

Just to clarify, or muddy the waters.

 

[4x4demon]

My concern on the whole issue was in ordering the short barreled upper. I'm aware of the SBR rules and that a "rifle" lower can not be mated with a short barreled upper without proper credentials. In this case however, I would be purchasing either a stripped lower or most preferably a "pistol" lower already assembled. I guess since the lower is the only part you need an FFL for (because that is the part that is considered the "gun") it woulldn't matter about buying the upper. Thanks for the links whitsend. I'll look them over when I get a little more time.

 

[bs875]

Read these.

http://www.atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2011-4.pdf
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_6_50/348908_ATF__pistol_to_rifle_to_pistol_is_legal.html

Stripped lower are listed as "Other" on 4473.
If you first build it as a pistol, then you can go to rifle and back to a pistol.
If you first build it as a rifle, then you can NOT go to a pistol.

Just to clarify, or muddy the waters.

I thought it was determined after the Thompson Center ruling that you could go back and forth regardless. The same with those Glock conversion kits that turn your pistol into a rifle. Honestly I gave up caring. Just buy one already they way you or get a stripped one.

Where is Freeport?

 

[RyanW]

Read these.

http://www.atf.gov/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2011-4.pdf
http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_6_50/348908_ATF__pistol_to_rifle_to_pistol_is_legal.html

Stripped lower are listed as "Other" on 4473.
If you first build it as a pistol, then you can go to rifle and back to a pistol.
If you first build it as a rifle, then you can NOT go to a pistol.

Just to clarify, or muddy the waters.

You can NEVER go "back" to pistol. Once equipped with a buttstock, it is a rifle or shotgun, no matter what. If you have a pistol lower and slap a buttstock on it, you need a stamp for SBR.

 

[whitsend]

You can NEVER go "back" to pistol. Once equipped with a buttstock, it is a rifle or shotgun, no matter what. If you have a pistol lower and slap a buttstock on it, you need a stamp for SBR.

What are you basing this on?

Did you read the letter from the ATF in the link I posted?
It says otherwise.

 

[troy_mclure]

The ATF made a special ruling for Thompson center encores and contenders. Then reversed it, then reupheld it.
Currently the t/c encore and contender is legal to swap from rifle to pistol to rifle, and excedera.

 

[RyanW]

What are you basing this on?

Did you read the letter from the ATF in the link I posted?
It says otherwise.

The Serbu shotgun is an AOW. It is only classified as an AOW because it starts as a pistol grip shotgun, with no buttstock. Had it been configured with a buttstock it would then be an SBS, as opposed to an AOW. The same shotgun comes in both configurations, but only one can be classified as AOW as opposed to SBS.

 

[whitsend]

The ATF made a special ruling for Thompson center encores and contenders. Then reversed it, then reupheld it.
Currently the t/c encore and contender is legal to swap from rifle to pistol to rifle, and excedera.

Actually the Supreme Court ruled in favor of Thompson/Center.
The ATF letter I posted a link to cites the Thompson/Center case but is not specific to just the Encore/Contender.
The letter is dated July 25, 2011 and supersedes all prior rulings.