Which of the two?

[SOLAteeda]

On the left is Remington 38 Special +P 125gr semi-jacketed hollowpoint. On the right is Federal 38 Special semi-wadcutter 158gr lead bullet. Which would you use for home defense out of the two?

 

[topgunz1]

I'd go with the +p hollowpoint... more velocity and a hollowpoint cant be a bad thing... I'm sure the .38 guru's will chime in soon

 

[SOLAteeda]

The gun being used is S&W .357 4", if that makes any difference. I just don't have any .357 ammo yet and found these in the ammo box.

 

[SpeedRacer]

Hollowpoint fo' shizzle...

 

[SOLAteeda]

Looks like I will be loading up the hollowpoints.

If anyone would like to share their opinions on their favorite .357mag/.38 range/HD rounds, I'm all ears and will be going to the store(or buying online) sometime this week.

 

[mprice]

this...

Federal Premium Personal Defense Ammunition PD357HS2H, 357 Remington Mag, Hydra-Shok Ammunition JHP, 130 GR, 1410 fps, 20 Rd/bx

my "bedside" weapon is a S&W model 28 (highway patrol) with a 4" barrel.

 

[altimar]

.38-wise, everyone's going to recommend Speer GoldDot .38spl +P.

For the range, whatever you can find cheapest, if you can find any these days.

 

[jimdana1942]

The HP probably, but you'll get more penetration with the SWC. I would feel just fine with either one.

 

[oleheat]

The hollowpoints- all day, everyday!

Wadcutters are better than nothing, but between the two- take the HPs....

 

[Leadslugga]

I handload for my .357 so I don't have first-hand opinions on lots of factory loads, but I do have "Ammo and Ballistics 3" which lists the velocity, energy, and other relevant numbers for almost all the current factory offerings. I'm going from memory here, so this may or may not be true, but I seem to remember the Hornady .357 140gr flex-tip loads having the highest performance (as far as energy). You really can't go wrong, though, with any premium hollow-point, gold dots, golden sabers, hydra-shoks, whatever. It is all good stuff, and by virtue of design, revolvers don't care what the bullet looks like for the purpose of reliability, so there isn't the need to test a load extensively for positive function like with autoloaders.

 

[SOLAteeda]

I managed to obtain a box of Winchester 110gr JHP .357 mag. Not quite what I would prefer, but should do the job if placed in the right spot. Eventually I will get something else, but until then atleast I have it loaded with .357

 

[charliepapa]

I say do yourself a favor and get you some fresh, new 357 JHP ammo. And yes, the Speer Gold Dots are designed to be shot out of shorter barrels so I'd go with those.

I had a bunch of stuff from over the years in a Ziploc bag, probably like the stuff in your "ammo box". Most of it worked but some didn't. Fortunately yours will be in a revolver and all you have to do is pull the trigger again. Either way, I'd still not want to trust my life to old ammo when there was new available.

 

[SOLAteeda]

Like I said, will definately be getting some better ammo soon, but would I be wrong to assume that the Winchester 110gr JHP .357 mag would have more punch than either of the two old .38s?

I have read some of Paul Gomez's thread on woud ballistics, and have spoken with Pangris about ballistics. I agree that shot placement is king, and will be getting some ammo with adequate penetration. Just wondering which ammo that I have on hand would be best.

Would the .38 SWC have as much/more penetration than the .357 JHP?

 

[Leadslugga]

I would say there is a chance that the .38 SWC could penetrate further than a really light (110 gr for example) .357, but only because the .357 might totally fragment/explode. If you got a .357 JHP and .38 SWC both in the same weight, the .357 would go much deeper, I'd be willing to bet.

Not that I have tried this myself.

 

[LACamper]

Remember penetration is good, but too much isn't. There's no point in dumping all that energy into the wall behind the target. Best case is the bullet gets stuck exiting in the back of the target's T-shirt. Anything more than that is just wasted powder.

 

[SOLAteeda]

Walmart had one box of Remington UMC 125 gr SJHP .357 mag, got it and managed to do a bit of shooting. I got to shoot a Kimber 1911 .45 and a Springer XD .45, and I do have to say that I prefer my S&W. I'm sure that with some practice I would do fine with either, but I find the sights on the revolver easier to use.

Thanks for the info everyone, gonna keep it loaded with the 125gr .357.

 

[buddy_fuentes]

Darn LSP972 is right again, the old 158 grain lead bullet was the best performer many years ago. If it worked then it will work now. There has been many advances in bullet design over the years so I would look for something up-dated if purchasing a new box of slugs. For now the 158 would be in my revolver.

Buddy

 

[TxShooter]

There are NO absolutes. You cannot say that cartridge X will do this everytime, and cartridge Y will not.

A trooper in the northeast part of the country died when he was shot by a guy who took six full-house .357 158gr JHPs center mass from three feet away. The guy was a huge fat slob, and while the initial impacts stunned and knocked him down, they didn't penetrate enough, and he was able to shoot from the ground, catching the trooper just under his vest.

An LSP trooper put five Remington 110gr .357 JHPs into a juiced-up crackhead (you could cover the group with your hand), and still had to fight him before the guy bled out. We went to a minimum 125gr bullet weight after THAT one.

While there are no absolutes, there ARE some generalities. Heavier is better, given reasonably similar velocites.

.

Steve, if I'm thinking of the same one, that's the Trooper Steve Coates shooting in South Carolina. We watched the dashcam video during patrol week, along with an interview with his killer. Coates was using a 4" 686 loaded with +P .38s, weight unspecified. The killer had an NAA .22 that entered Coates' armpit when he reached for his shoulder mic.

 

[buddy_fuentes]

Steve, if I'm thinking of the same one, that's the Trooper Steve Coates shooting in South Carolina. We watched the dashcam video during patrol week, along with an interview with his killer. Coates was using a 4" 686 loaded with +P .38s, weight unspecified. The killer had an NAA .22 that entered Coates' armpit when he reached for his shoulder mic.

I remember seeing it too, I just don't remember any details other than the Officer was shot with a mini gun and it (bullet) went through the heart from the side and missed the vest.

I worked homicide for many years and saw so many shootings it wasn't funny. And you are right, there are no absolutes. But you do have a better chance of surviving a gunfight with good hits, on the bad guy, and a decent caliber weapon. You can fight with a .44 mag. and not make a hit or not make a solid hit and things are not likely to go your way.

 

[LouisianaMan]

To answer your original question directly, I'd choose the LSWC (almost) every time, but wouldn't feel poorly-armed with either.

My central assumption is that in a crisis everybody's moving, it's probably dark, etc., so I figure placement is center mass if I'm lucky & keep my cool. That could require lots of penetration--thru raised arms, turned sideways, heavy clothing, etc.--to get to the vitals. Expansion is great if it happens, but questionable against heavy clothing from a snubbie, and effective expansion acts to reduce penetration.

As some others have suggested, fresh ammo beats old stuff just due to potential reliability issues. If I knew the ammo had been stored appropriately, though, I would expect it to work for many years.

I've read a bunch of the theories, case studies, refutations, & refutations of refutations on the issue of handgun "stopping power." My personal priorities are (1) shot placement, (2) penetration, and (3) expansion, assuming controllability factor is relatively equal.

So I load my .45LC w/255g LFN at 870fps and .38SPLs w/200g LSWC at 750fps (720fps from snubbie). I sacrifice the possibility of expansion to ensure controllability & penetration to vitals. I want to poke full-caliber holes quickly & deep--preferably T&T. Unless I get a "psychological" stop or hit CNS, it'll come down to how quickly the BG bleeds out.

Note that a big part of my equation is rural environment HD (not CCW), no concern about over-penetration, and likelihood of indoor shot up to 60 feet, thru leather sofas & chairs. I understand the concern about overpenetration, but generally find it hard to imagine a situation in which I would shoot with one type of round, but not with another. But if you live in an apartment building, you have to try your best to reduce the danger to others. In apts., you probably need to consciously choose a round with very low penetration, even though it reduces your own safety. Probably every one of my 200g LSWCs WOULD go thru the BG, sheet rock, and into the next apt (or 2 or 3), so I wouldn't load that round in that situation.

Just my $02.