Did Walton and Johnson cross the line on No Knock Officers killed and Injured?

Hitman · Sep 18, 2014

I don't often listen to Walton & Johnson b/c
I listen to AFR/Jeffress until 0630 during my commute to work
and afterwards have about 10 more minutes to work. Sometimes
I put it on Walton & Johnson or Bob & Tom.

This morning it was W&J.....and I was surprised to hear what I did.

Simple quote;

"I'm glad they were shot".

In reference to another No Knock Raid that went sour in Texas
where one Officer was killed and 3 others wounded.

A glass pipe was found ...

Walton and Johnson then insinuated that more of this will/should happen
in order to get these SWAT Teams to end these pre-dawn no knock raids
on non-major criminals.

So did W&J cross the line with you? as far as a listener?

I'm completely and absolutely in disagreement with W&J on this issue.
I may not agree with the current Detective work, or lack there of
that seems to be the root of these botched raids, but in no way
do I think Officers needing to be killed is the answer.

This is a seriously appalling thing to say.

NOLAShootist · Sep 18, 2014

I was listening to that as well and winced when I heard it.

Way I look at it, it's entertainment. Not to be taken as gospel.

Frankly, I refuse to be one of the whiny butthurt MFers in this country that can take a joke only so long as it doesnt offend them.

Not saying you are being one. But, I see that way too often. People will laugh right along with some terrible stuff until it hits home to their race, religion, etc and then they get all up in arms.

Hitman · Sep 18, 2014

I didn't hear them laughing.

....and Jokes about a dead officer and shooting them in the face
like they kept repeating over and over again for No Knock Warrants ....

In fact he said before;
"I know this is going to **** off a lot of Officers but....."

....if that passes as a joke these days, maybe I'm out of touch.

Devilneck · Sep 18, 2014

I don't agree with no knock raids on Americans in America.

NOLAShootist · Sep 18, 2014

Hitman said:
....if that passes as a joke these days, maybe I'm out of touch.

Im not saying youre out of touch. Youre saying it. Im just nodding along.

I keed, I keed.

W&J is, to me, a good example of what I was talking about. They say plenty of things about other races, religions, cultures, retarded people, gays, etc that are wholly offensive to other people. And, I laugh. So, who am I to get offended when they say something offensive to me/my "culture?"

But, and maybe this is just me, but if I take a summary of all of the terrible **** I have laughed at over the years, I cant get offended about anything. Ever.

And, besides, in LE, no one is under the illusion that everyone likes us. Id imagine Ive met more people who'd rather see me dead than alive throughout my career. Its just part of it. Ce la vie.

Wolfgang1952 · Sep 18, 2014

I’ll properly get banned but I don’t care……
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized. What part of UNREASONABLE does law enforcement not understand. A search warrant should be presented during regular business hours (8 a.m. to 8 p.m.) during the regular work week ( Monday to Friday). The only reason that anyone (including law enforcement) has for breaking down doors at any time of the day is to terrorize and inflict damage.

WOLF

NOLAShootist · Sep 18, 2014

Wolfgang1952 said:
A search warrant should be presented during regular business hours (8 a.m. to 8 p.m.) during the regular work week ( Monday to Friday). The only reason that anyone (including law enforcement) has for breaking down doors at any time of the day is to terrorize and inflict damage.

WOLF

Maybe let em know we're coming too? Send a flyer over the day before... ya know, so they can be dressed and ready to calmly walk out and greet us and quietly get in a squad car to head on down to central booking?

Speed, surprise and violence of action. Its the way to quickly, effectively and safely neutralize a threat.

I dont see anything wrong with no knock warrants or early morning warrant services when executed properly. (Though, **** certainly went sideways in this case.)

Sarcasm aside, I agree with you - sometimes. But, to make blanket statements like that is ridiculous. Limit the tools in their toolbox to M-F business hours only, and nothing will ever get accomplished. The bad guys would just know to not be home from 8-5. I do feel that, which a lot of places have moved to, warrants need to be double and triple checked before the judge signs off to make sure all the ducks are in a row. Then, during tac briefing, addresses and all that **** need to have multiple sets of eyes on to make sure the right door is being breached.

Emperor · Sep 18, 2014

NOLAShootist said:
Im not saying youre out of touch. Youre saying it. Im just nodding along. I keed, I keed.

W&J is, to me, a good example of what I was talking about. They say plenty of things about other races, religions, cultures, retarded people, gays, etc that are wholly offensive to other people. And, I laugh. So, who am I to get offended when they say something offensive to me/my "culture?"

But, and maybe this is just me, but if I take a summary of all of the terrible **** I have laughed at over the years, I cant get offended about anything. Ever.

And, besides, in LE, no one is under the illusion that everyone likes us. Id imagine Ive met more people who'd rather see me dead than alive throughout my career. Its just part of it. Ce la vie.

Well put. I'm in total agreement!

Id imagine Ive met more people who'd rather see me dead than alive throughout my career.

This^ seems a little strong; but I guess since you must be including criminals in your sampling you are probably 50/50.

A5Mag12 · Sep 18, 2014

Devilneck said:
I don't agree with no knock raids on Americans in America.

This should be what every one is talking about here. Not a couple ass hats from the radio.

NO KNOCK RAIDS ARE AGAINST EVERYTHING AMERICAN!

Devilneck · Sep 18, 2014

NOLAShootist said:
Maybe let em know we're coming too? Send a flyer over the day before... ya know, so they can be dressed and ready to calmly walk out and greet us and quietly get in a squad car to head on down to central booking?

Speed, surprise and violence of action. Its the way to quickly, effectively and safely neutralize a threat.

I dont see anything wrong with no knock warrants or early morning warrant services when executed properly. (Though, **** certainly went sideways in this case.)

I don't think it's unreasonable to knock, announce that you're law enforcement and have a warrant, and then enter if there is no response within a reasonable amount of time. Or if there is a response of gunfire, "Skroo you pigs!" or some other impolite answer, then an immediate forced entry would have a justification.

Other than that, there is no legitimate reason.

NOLAShootist · Sep 18, 2014

Emperor said:
Well put. I'm in total agreement!

This^ seems a little strong; but I guess since you must be including criminals in your sampling you are probably 50/50.

I learned something early on in my career...

I was at a bar one night. (It happens.) I was in normal clothes. I was sitting at the bar, talking to some girl and a guy bellied up to the bar next to me and sat down. I looked over and immediately recognized him as a guy I had arrested (for DWI) a night or two earlier. He looked at me, smiled and ordered. We even BS'd about the game that was on. Had zero clue who I was.

What did I learn that night? We (uniformed LE) arent people to the majority of the populace. We're a badge and a gun and nothing more.

Over the years, it was proven time and time again. Running into people I had dealt with at work in social situations and theyd have no clue. Walking into a place to eat and watch the entire room look at your badge and then down to your holster. Thats it.

Im not bemoaning the fact. But, it serves to further illustrate my, "rather see me dead than alive" comment.

Yes, I was including bad guys in that comment.

But, if this makes any sense... when people only see a badge and gun, and dont consider you a person... why would they care if a badge/gun lives or dies? That only happens if the guy wearing it is thought of as a husband, father, brother, son, neighbor, fellow Church member, etc...

So, in clarification, maybe it isnt actively wishing harm on LE in as much as it is a complete lack of concern for what happens to us. You cant tell me you havent heard time and time again, "Well, thats what those guys get paid for" when people are sitting around discussing an EOW in the headlines. If I had a dime for every time Ive heard that, Id be rich.

NOLAShootist · Sep 18, 2014

Devilneck said:
I don't think it's unreasonable to knock, announce that you're law enforcement and have a warrant, and then enter if there is no response within a reasonable amount of time. Or if there is a response of gunfire, "Skroo you pigs!" or some other impolite answer, then an immediate forced entry would have a justification.

Other than that, there is no legitimate reason.

I was waiting on this...

Wilson v Arkansas did find that a "knock and announce" is part of the 4th. However, exigency is taken into consideration in this. If you can destroy evidence or do harm to an officer (with documentation), a no knock can be granted.

Now, the time between when the knock occurs and when the location can be breached... Frankly, it isnt very long. 15 seconds, according to the SCOTUS ruling on US v Banks. There is not much difference between a knock and no knock in terms of timing. Yes, there is a brief delay, but it aint much. People often fail to realize that.

Emperor · Sep 18, 2014

NOLAShootist said:
I learned something early on in my career...

I was at a bar one night. (It happens.) I was in normal clothes. I was sitting at the bar, talking to some girl and a guy bellied up to the bar next to me and sat down. I looked over and immediately recognized him as a guy I had arrested (for DWI) a night or two earlier. He looked at me, smiled and ordered. We even BS'd about the game that was on. Had zero clue who I was.

What did I learn that night? We (uniformed LE) arent people to the majority of the populace. We're a badge and a gun and nothing more.

Over the years, it was proven time and time again. Running into people I had dealt with at work in social situations and theyd have no clue. Walking into a place to eat and watch the entire room look at your badge and then down to your holster. Thats it.

Im not bemoaning the fact. But, it serves to further illustrate my, "rather see me dead than alive" comment.

Yes, I was including bad guys in that comment.

But, if this makes any sense... when people only see a badge and gun, and dont consider you a person... why would they care if a badge/gun lives or dies? That only happens if the guy wearing it is thought of as a husband, father, brother, son, neighbor, fellow Church member, etc...

So, in clarification, maybe it isnt actively wishing harm on LE in as much as it is a complete lack of concern for what happens to us. You cant tell me you havent heard time and time again, "Well, thats what those guys get paid for" when people are sitting around discussing an EOW in the headlines. If I had a dime for every time Ive heard that, Id be rich.

Funny how it is. You guys are either revered or hated based on a line of whether the judgmental one is a victim or a criminal.

JR1572 · Sep 18, 2014

NOLAShootist said:
I was waiting on this...

Wilson v Arkansas did find that a "knock and announce" is part of the 4th. However, exigency is taken into consideration in this. If you can destroy evidence or do harm to an officer (with documentation), a no knock can be granted.

Now, the time between when the knock occurs and when the location can be breached... Frankly, it isnt very long. There is not much difference between a knock and no knock in terms of timing. Yes, there is a brief delay, but it aint much. People often fail to realize that.

Stop. Really. Stop it. It doesn't matter how many times you explain the way things work in the real world. It doesn't apply here. These people refuse to understand how things work. Many others have tried to educate the masses here, but the message will simply not get through. Their minds are made up.

JR1572

Hitman · Sep 18, 2014

The question is;

Do you agree with Walton and Johnson;
"That you are glad these Officers were shot/killed"?

This is not a misinterpretation or misquote.
He said, "I'm glad they were shot".

4 people say Yes.
I find that disturbing.

Emperor · Sep 18, 2014

JR1572 said:
Stop. Really. Stop it. It doesn't matter how many times you explain the way things work in the real world. It doesn't apply here. These people refuse to understand how things work. Many others have tried to educate the masses here, but the message will simply not get through. Their minds are made up.

JR1572

Yes! Many people refuse to understand the LE side of the argument; and yes, times have changed. However, truth be told; if we held the line on the US Constitution (and I mean across the board), no-knocks would not be an option.

Seems the unabated misinterpretations of that document alone perpetuates all the BS.

NOLAShootist · Sep 18, 2014

JR1572 said:
Stop. Really. Stop it. It doesn't matter how many times you explain the way things work in the real world. It doesn't apply here. These people refuse to understand how things work. Many others have tried to educate the masses here, but the message will simply not get through. Their minds are made up.

JR1572

LOL. Yeah, I kinda figured that was gonna be the outcome of all this. Logic and reason tend not to play a big role in these discussions. But, Im jacked up on caffeine and dont have **** to do today since the GF flew to Atlanta. So, I put my trollin pants on and waded into this shitshow.

MALIBU12 · Sep 18, 2014

Devilneck said:
I don't agree with no knock raids on Americans in America.

THIS!

Vsotok10 · Sep 18, 2014

NOLAShootist said:
Speed, surprise and violence of action. Its the way to quickly, effectively and safely neutralize a threat.

It's also the way to get killed by an American citizen who is rightfully defending himself/family/property. Whats sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes - if you don't want to get killed serving a no-knock then find another way to apprehend the suspect. I don't want anyone to die in the line of duty and I feel for those officers killed just like i feel for the innocents killed; however, I blame LE for all the deaths and feel they earned what they got.

Hitman · Sep 18, 2014

NOLAShootist said:
Logic and reason tend not to play a big role in these discussions.

I wonder why......

NOLAShootist said:
So, I put my trollin pants

Oh I see ..... thanks for helping :doh:

Did Walton and Johnson cross the line on No Knock Officers killed and Injured?

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