Radar Detectors - do they work?

[AustinBR]

Newer radars are hard to evade. They take a quick, split second snapshot of your vehicle (with a photo) and that's it, you're done. The less funded PDs still use old "guns", that require longer "focusing" and those you can pretty much beat.

The new LIDAR systems are what I think you are referring to. They don't take a snapshot (picture) of your vehicle though. I think you are thinking of the speed cameras that some cities and states have picked up. We don't have any around BR, and the ones that I know of within an hour drive aren't the new super awesome ones that you are thinking of.

 

[Korl]

There was that new dragon cam that Livingston parish or denham springs was talking of using. They decided not to though last I heard.
Still uses LIDAR.

 

[JWG223]

Newer radars are hard to evade. They take a quick, split second snapshot of your vehicle (with a photo) and that's it, you're done. The less funded PDs still use old "guns", that require longer "focusing" and those you can pretty much beat.

It's impossible to evade radar with current technology, and jamming it with active cancelling is an FAA violation (not to play with), but it is very possible to detect it before it hits you. It's hard to aim a radar gun. I own and use one. They put out a pretty wide beam and if there are more than 1 vehicle, it's pretty difficult at any serious range to pick out the offender. A vehicle-mounted system is obviously much better, point the cruiser where you want it I guess, and figure out the parameters of its spread. Most good radar detectors will detect IO blips from 1-2+ miles away, though. This helps you to understand that one is in operation, and where it is, as long as you are not the ONLY one on the road for miles. It's even easier when the officers sit there spamming. They do this because...why not? It's easier, and plenty of people run unprotected so they will hit their quota, anyway. They don't have some vendetta, they just want to get home at the end of a shift that was productive enough to avoid an arse chewing for being unproductive.

 

[Suburbazine]

http://www.mphindustries.com/pdfs/Ranger Datasheet 2-page 101014 2.pdf

 

[JWG223]

http://www.mphindustries.com/pdfs/Ranger Datasheet 2-page 101014 2.pdf

Interesting. I wonder how well it works in the real world. First I've seen of it. It will still give itself away 1-2 miles from your position, though.

 

[Suburbazine]

Interesting. I wonder how well it works in the real world. First I've seen of it. It will still give itself away 1-2 miles from your position, though.

They have an optional low-power mode that has a max range of about 375' and an average detectable range of about 900' (although the expensive detectors probably can hear it at 1400+). I think there's some limitations on using it due to interference, though.

 

[JR1572]

It's impossible to evade radar with current technology, and jamming it with active cancelling is an FAA violation (not to play with), but it is very possible to detect it before it hits you. It's hard to aim a radar gun. I own and use one. They put out a pretty wide beam and if there are more than 1 vehicle, it's pretty difficult at any serious range to pick out the offender. A vehicle-mounted system is obviously much better, point the cruiser where you want it I guess, and figure out the parameters of its spread. Most good radar detectors will detect IO blips from 1-2+ miles away, though. This helps you to understand that one is in operation, and where it is, as long as you are not the ONLY one on the road for miles. It's even easier when the officers sit there spamming. They do this because...why not? It's easier, and plenty of people run unprotected so they will hit their quota, anyway. They don't have some vendetta, they just want to get home at the end of a shift that was productive enough to avoid an arse chewing for being unproductive.

I usually avoid asking you questions because you think I'm picking on you, but I'm really curious now. I know it's legal to own, but why do you have a radar gun? Did you not believe your radar detector works?

Most people I know who have radar guns have kids playing baseball/softball or have r/c cars.

JR1572

 

[madwabbit]

I know it's , but my valentine1 has saved me ~6 tickets in as many years traveling from texas to florida. It's probably saved me another 5-6 that I just don't recall.

 

[JWG223]

I usually avoid asking you questions because you think I'm picking on you, but I'm really curious now. I know it's legal to own, but why do you have a radar gun? Did you not believe your radar detector works?

Most people I know who have radar guns have kids playing baseball/softball or have r/c cars.

JR1572

Dad picked it up for $100. It fell into disuse like his 289 v8 trike, 300saum AR, and other oddities he built or bought at a discount. I borrowed it from time to time.

 

[LNSvince]

there are 14 pages now.

anyone posted this:

Police LiDAR countermeasures[citation needed][edit]

LiDAR jamming devices (Blinder(tm), etc.). This units create slurry of 905nm pulses to try to confuse the Police LiDAR unit. Some units can indicate if an attempt at jamming has occurred and in some states it is illegal to jam LiDAR (such as Virginia laws state, in summary, "Any attempt to thwart or negate police attempts to measure traffic speed is illegal."

LiDAR 905nm specific absorbing pigments and dyes: Since 905nm LiDAR is simply a 50W pulsed laser there are pigments and dyes on the market that can be made into paints and clear-coats that will absorb most of the LiDAR that strikes the body of a vehicle. Absorbing dyes and pigments are often dark green, black, or rust-brown in visual appearance. Their existence can be masked by using overcoatings that are transparent to 905nm wave lengths.

LiDAR 905nm specific deflectors [reflecting LiDAR away from police point-of-origin]: On top of #2 above it is possible to design a vehicle with angled surfaces that further prevent reflections from going back to the point of origin (the police LiDAR unit).
License Plate Shaping-Angeling Technique: One simple method of reducing a vehicle reflectivity to LIDAR is to bend the license plate so that LIDAR beams hitting it will be deflected at a slightly upward angle (into the sky). To determine if this will work for you you first need to determine if you have a "Directionally Imaged Retroreflective" coating on your plate. Do this by going outside at night and hitting your plate with a low powered laser pointer. A strong return when the laser is positioned close to your eye will reveal that you have a such a coating on your plate. Standing about 1000 ft away bend the plate upward in small increments until you get little or no return. Also bending the plate edge to edge so that it is no longer flat but has a slight radius may reduce the amount of return.

License Plate Painting Technique: This is specifically illegal in many states: Painting over the retro-reflective (white portions) of the license plate with a white acrylic primer paint (usually Titanium Dioxide as a pigment) will negate the retro-reflectivity of the surface. Painting this over a coat of carbon-black paint (Kylon(tm) Ultra-Flat Black) will further increase the effectiveness of this coating. The plate will not be reflective to headlights at night and probably draw the attention of police however. A light fogging of white paint may reduce retro-reflectivity without completely negating it and used in conjunction with Shaping/Angeling (above) may drastically reduce the reflection. Also powdering the plate with talcum powder will reduce the retro-reflectivity of the plate to some unknown degree (wipe talc from lettering).

Motorcycle Plates Present a Weaker Reflection Standard automobile license plates are about 6" high X 12" wide. A motorcycle, having a plate size of 4" high x 7" wide has 38.9% less reflective surface area and so naturally presents a lessor amount of LIDAR return (given the same distance). Manipulating, over-coating, or otherwise modifying the surface of a license plate to reduce its reflectivity is against the law in many states.

High Technology AR CoatingsLiDAR 904nm specific (AR) anti-reflective coatings (for clear glass/plastics). There are companies that produce tuned coatings that are narrow-band specific and can be made to peak at 904nm there by negating all but a small 3% or less reflection. These coatings can be used on clear surfaces such as windshields, headlights, or even bexel retro-reflectors in various reflectors, turn signal indicators, tail lights, etc. on most modern vehicles.

LiDAR obfuscation measures and theories—Light travels at differing velocities through differing materials. It may be possible to use that characteristic to create a passive system that provides a strong reflection back to the LiDAR unit with a number of overlapping pulses that have been delayed by minute but varying amount. The theory is that this would confuse the LiDAR unit into trying again until it gets a clean reading (which conceivably—it may never get).

Beating the RDD Radar detector detector: Radar detector detectors are a police tool and detect the harmonic RF leakage that emanates from the oscillating circuit in most Radar detectors. You can beat this tool by carefully choosing a radar-LiDAR detector that has improved circuitry preventing harmonics leakage in the ranges that the RDD units are looking for. However, every time the radar-LiDAR detector manufactures react to a new Law Enforcement capability with a safeguard so too the Law Enforcement suppliers react by re-designing their

RDD to detect even formerly undetectable radar-LiDAR Detectors. Radar has not died out. X-band is not rarely used but K and Ka band are used all over the USA (Ku band used in Europe).

Crowd-Sourced Intelligence: Applications such as www.waze.com (and others) provide a method for traffic to report on the GPS location of police speed traps and traffic cameras, etc. and users can gain real-time intelligence. Users get a warning on their smart phone in advance of moving into the trap zone. As of October 2013 Waze had 17M users.

 

[MOTOR51]

Dad picked it up for $100. It fell into disuse like his 289 v8 trike, 300saum AR, and other oddities he built or bought at a discount. I borrowed it from time to time.

For $100 I can only assume it's not a good one. Your previous statement regarding it being hard to pick our who is speeding with radar is not accurate. A radar/LIDAR is only used to verify that a person is speeding. You should only use the device to confirm what you already know.


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[JR1572]

For $100 I can only assume it's not a good one. Your previous statement regarding it being hard to pick our who is speeding with radar is not accurate. A radar/LIDAR is only used to verify that a person is speeding. You should only use the device to confirm what you already know.


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Watch it. Someone with less experience than you will be here in a moment to dispute that statement.

JR1572

 

[madwabbit]

Grab whatever detector you want and drive with it a few months. Pay attention to how many times it failed to warn you about the officer you just drove past, and chalk that up as a ticket. The 80.00 noise machine at walmart alerted me 2-3 times to upcoming speed traps in a 4-6mo time frame or so, and failed to alert me 2-3 times as well. I figured it was ~50/50... In this case, I reasoned I'd be better off rolling the dice on being pulled over by a merciful officer vs having an electronic "i speed all day" advertisement on my dashboard- so I gave the detector away to a friend.

I picked up the valentine when I started driving and traveling much more. I use the wireless display relayed to their iphone app and you'd never know I had a detector in the vehicle just by looking in. It's saved me more than a few times, especially when its an officer approaching from behind.


With note to a very detailed post by LNSVince above, the mythbusters (credibility at your opinion) demonstrated that all methods of license plate alteration failed miserably, but a few friends with crotch rockets swear that there are clear covers in addition to common practices of bending and mounting plates in specific manners that do have an impact. I don't know if there is any truth to this- probably just the "bro science" they share amongst each other.

 

[JWG223]

For $100 I can only assume it's not a good one. Your previous statement regarding it being hard to pick our who is speeding with radar is not accurate. A radar/LIDAR is only used to verify that a person is speeding. You should only use the device to confirm what you already know.


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It's a MPH Industries K-15 dopplar. I don't know where it ranks on the food-chain. He bought it about a decade ago, so I am sure that it's not the newest and latest/greatest.

Given your statement, though, how do you write a ticket? Ask them how fast they were going and then adjust the number up or down 1 or so to make it seem legit? If they say "I don't know", then take a guess and see how loudly they argue? I thought that the purpose of the radar was to collect the correct amount of money for the infraction. Did I misunderstand what you meant?

 

[madwabbit]

It's a MPH Industries K-15 dopplar. I don't know where it ranks on the food-chain.

Given your statement, though, how do you write a ticket? Ask them how fast they were going and then adjust the number up or down 1 or so to make it seem legit? If they say "I don't know", then take a guess and see how loudly they argue? I thought that the purpose of the radar was to collect the correct amount of money for the infraction. Did I misunderstand what you meant?

Never say "i don't know".
Never say "maybe a few mph over"
Never say "a little fast, maybe"

correct answer: never say. You've got a constitutional right against self incrimination. If an officer believes you committed a crime, the burden is on him to prove it. Don't be a jerk, and don't admit guilt on the side of the highway.

Politely accept your ticket and dispute it in court.

 

[JWG223]

Never say "i don't know".
Never say "maybe a few mph over"
Never say "a little fast, maybe"

correct answer: never say. You've got a constitutional right against self incrimination. If an officer believes you committed a crime, the burden is on him to prove it. Don't be a jerk, and don't admit guilt on the side of the highway.

Politely accept your ticket and dispute it in court.

I typically tell the truth and am politely sent on my way. Maybe 1/3 I get a ticket, and then I thank the officer and show up in court. If I think I was going a bit fast, I own the fact. Why lie about it? Even if you get a ticket, the officer is not a prosecutor. I agree 100%. Go to court. All the want is money, you buy them off and go about your business and the ticket goes away like it never happened. Its the price you pay for the privilege of getting places sooner most of the time.

 

[madwabbit]

I typically tell the truth and am politely sent on my way. Maybe 1/3 I get a ticket, and then I thank the officer and show up in court. If I think I was going a bit fast, I own the fact. Why lie about it? Even if you get a ticket, the officer is not a prosecutor. I agree 100%. Go to court. All the want is money, you buy them off and go about your business and the ticket goes away like it never happened. Its the price you pay for the privilege of getting places sooner most of the time.

its a revenue collection opportunity, not a crime detrimental to your personal character. I watch those COPS shows and stuff occasionally and it absolutely shocks me how many people are stupid enough to yell scream and argue with an officer on the side of the interstate. The only idea more stupid than arguing with him is running from him lol.

 

[cajunranger]

I just put a Bayou Shooter sticker in my rear window. All the police are on this forum.

 

[alpinehyperlite]

I picked up the valentine when I started driving and traveling much more. I use the wireless display relayed to their iphone app and you'd never know I had a detector in the vehicle just by looking in. It's saved me more than a few times, especially when its an officer approaching from behind.

http://www.stalkerradar.com/spectreIV/redirect.html

Given your statement, though, how do you write a ticket? Ask them how fast they were going and then adjust the number up or down 1 or so to make it seem legit? If they say "I don't know", then take a guess and see how loudly they argue? I thought that the purpose of the radar was to collect the correct amount of money for the infraction. Did I misunderstand what you meant?

We are trained to estimate speed then verify our estimation by radar/lidar. In order to qualify for re certification we have to be within 3 mph on 10 vehicles in a row in estimation then verify with the unit.

 

[MOTOR51]

It's a MPH Industries K-15 dopplar. I don't know where it ranks on the food-chain. He bought it about a decade ago, so I am sure that it's not the newest and latest/greatest.

Given your statement, though, how do you write a ticket? Ask them how fast they were going and then adjust the number up or down 1 or so to make it seem legit? If they say "I don't know", then take a guess and see how loudly they argue? I thought that the purpose of the radar was to collect the correct amount of money for the infraction. Did I misunderstand what you meant?

I observe traffic and find a car that's speeding. I visually estimate his speed and then use the radar/LIDAR to verify my visual estimation.


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