Marskville Shooting (Nov 2015) body cam footage released

[RedStickChick]

As a Police officer, and a Use of Force instructor, this is just sickening. i do feel sorry for the police officer assisting to that mess not knowing what exactly was going on. Thankfully for him he did not fire when shots were being fired by the state Marshals.

These guys are local. The position is "laughable" from what I've been told.

 

[JR1572]

These guys are local. The position is "laughable" from what I've been told.

Yeah, I've heard that about most marshall's offices.

JR1572

 

[Whitebread]

Paradigms and SOP are forced to change with society's climate. 50 years ago we didn't have people randomly bring rifles into shopping malls, schools, or churches to open fire indiscriminately. We didn't have roadside IED's in central park. We didn't have a culture that hated accountability. What we DID have was a respect for law and order, an ethical obligation to be appreciative for community service, and a general demeanor to assist when possible.

This from one tax paying citizen to another: these are the people that come when you call for help. if you've never had to make the call, you are blessed beyond numbers. If you have, you'll understand. When I have to dial 911, I don't want barney fife coming to politely knock on my door and ask the nice fella to put his gun down so we can all go home for supper. No, for my phone call and tax dollars I want Seal Team Six. I want a clear message that this isn't tolerated, and I want it broadcasted so clearly and vividly that it sends a message not only to those that committed the crime, but to others that may consider it in the future.

This wanton disrespect for law enforcement has become trendy in a generation that both lacks accountability and is allergic to responsibility. In fact, officers today are in a no-win scenario for public judgement. If Barney Fife shows up they laud that he is inept, under qualified, and unfit for the position. If Rambo shows up, they say he's militaristic and presents a hostile image of police relations.

The truth is that people are generally unhappy with the state of things, and its easier to complain than to suggest solutions.

You missed my intent with the Andy and Barney comparison. My point wasn't training or ability it was demeanor. Andy was the "officer friendly" and Barney was was wound like a 12 day clock and was ready to throw a jaywalker in the pokey at the drop of a hate. He also refused to take constructive criticism from his fellow neighbors because he was the "lawman" and was incl control of the whole situation. Half the dang show was Andy I un-ruffling Barney's feathers and keeping peace in the town. My biggest point here quite similar to unseen's. I understand they have dangerous jobs to do I greatly appreciate it (inspite of what some think), but this knee-jerk reaction to demonize someone for calling fault where he sees it is foolish unproductive and works against good community relations.

 

[981GT4]

I can't disagree. I see it as a shift the concept of policing and less of a shift in individual officers' mindsets. And it's not shoot first ask questions later. It's let me step on your rights to make sure I feel safe. I sure wish I had the right to stop and forcibly search a few wierdos that I come in contact with to make sure they have nothing that could hurt me or themselves. I think it is safe to say all of us here a Bayou Shooter want officers to go home safe to their families each and every night, morning whatever their shift change is, but it's my belief over the last 50 years as an institution their has been a pyridine shift from (forgive my goofy analogy it's not a slam) of more Barney less Andy.

Again like i said Go request to do use of force or shoot no shoot scenarios with a police department. It will change your negative mindset in a heart beat. and understand that split second decision means life and death law enforcement.

Just like the San Diego shooting the other day, Guy jumps out of truck with pocket in hand then quickly in a second pulls themout ina gesture he is holding a gun .. what do you do? you shoot, that what you do.

no but white bread would think about it for 5 seconds and make absolutely sure its not a gun. but if its not a fake object and a real gun, guess what? your dead.

maybe if suspects stopped acting like idiots and wanting to get shot by police. police would not shoot as many people.


or what if someone pointed a air soft pistol at you after you chased him a quarter mile down the road? DO YOU honestly think you would tell its a Fake gun?? no you wouldnt in that split second moment.

 

[Whitebread]

Who is forcibly searching people at random? You wonder why LEO think of you as a "cop hater". Stop posting baseless anti police **** and following it up with post about how you respect LEO's. Own what you are, it's ok.


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I wasn't saying at random. If someone is suspicious and they make you feel uncomfortable while you are in official contact with them what do you do?

 

[JoeLiberty]

go request to do a use of force training with police officers. I get what your trying to say but you basis for police having a mindset of "when in doubt just kill someone" your mindset is flawed to the most extreme.
.

You're a trainer, right? Hook us up. I for one love training and agree it would be useful to see first hand how the police are taught. When is the next class?

 

[981GT4]

You're a trainer, right? Hook us up. I for one love training and agree it would be useful to see first hand how the police are taught. When is the next class?

I would have to see if i could do it for a non LEO first off, as im a Federal agent. not sure if my agency would bless that off.

but you could always ask your local PD or sheriff.

 

[Whitebread]

Again like i said Go request to do use of force or shoot no shoot scenarios with a police department. It will change your negative mindset in a heart beat. and understand that split second decision means life and death law enforcement.

Just like the San Diego shooting the other day, Guy jumps out of truck with pocket in hand then quickly in a second pulls themout ina gesture he is holding a gun .. what do you do? you shoot, that what you do.

no but white bread would think about it for 5 seconds and make absolutely sure its not a gun. but if its not a fake object and a real gun, guess what? your dead.

maybe if suspects stopped acting like idiots and wanting to get shot by police. police would not shoot as many people.


or what if someone pointed a air soft pistol at you after you chased him a quarter mile down the road? DO YOU honestly think you would tell its a Fake gun?? no you wouldnt in that split second moment.

You miss me entirely. In a life or death situation someone's refusing commands appears to be making a move that may require deadly force, I get it you got to do what you got to do. I make it a personal habit to not make threatening or what could be confused for theatening moves with all of my daily interactions not just leo because if you are making a feasibly threatening move on me I am likely to respond. I have been speaking more towards the non life threatening situations. Non combative disagreements are the worst example. Another great example is traffic duty and the risks many departments find exceptable in making a simple traffic stop. Or the fact that an office has the right to dis-arm (never happened by the way) me at will because maybe I'm a retard who would rather murder a man then pay a ticket. That's the silly stuff that causes a perception problem with the general public, not the nut bags wilding in the streets, but the good folks who will back the blue more often than not.

 

[981GT4]

You miss me entirely. In a life or death situation someone's refusing commands appears to be making a move that may require deadly force, I get it you got to do what you got to do. I make it a personal habit to not make threatening or what could be confused for theatening moves with all of my daily interactions not just leo because if you are making a feasibly threatening move on me I am likely to respond. I have been speaking more towards the non life threatening situations. Non combative disagreements are the worst example. Another great example is traffic duty and the risks many departments find exceptable in making a simple traffic stop. Or the fact that an office has the right to dis-arm (never happened by the way) me at will because maybe I'm a retard who would rather murder a man then pay a ticket. That's the silly stuff that causes a perception problem with the general public, not the nut bags wilding in the streets, but the good folks who will back the blue more often than not.

this was what you stated "The mindset is more of a wartime mindset instead of a peace officer mindset. There are certainly terrible people on the street that wish to do harm, but just as a burning building, that is a risk you except when you put that badge on. I believe you have a commitment to the public to be absolutely sure before pulling a trigger, a commitment that supersedes your own life and the will of your family and friends. To me, that servant mindset is what makes the job noble and respectable. "

So.. If i understand you because Police wear badges and sword to protect and serve , we basically should just not care about our own lives? We understand our job is risky. but we also have a Winning mindset, not a survival mindset. There is no such thing as a peace officer mindset, never was , never will be.

this is the dumbest thing ive actually ever read anyone say about police.

 

[Whitebread]

this was what you stated "The mindset is more of a wartime mindset instead of a peace officer mindset. There are certainly terrible people on the street that wish to do harm, but just as a burning building, that is a risk you except when you put that badge on. I believe you have a commitment to the public to be absolutely sure before pulling a trigger, a commitment that supersedes your own life and the will of your family and friends. To me, that servant mindset is what makes the job noble and respectable. "

So.. If i understand you because Police wear badges and sword to protect and serve , we basically should just not care about our own lives? We understand our job is risky. but we also have a Winning mindset, not a survival mindset. There is no such thing as a peace officer mindset, never was , never will be.

this is the dumbest thing ive actually ever read anyone say about police.

You are quoting the wrong guy however I did say I do not disagree. Please use your Google about a peace officer. And just incase you can't: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_enforcement_officer


A law enforcement officer (LEO)[1] or peace officer, in North American English, is a public-sector employee whose duties primarily involve the enforcement of laws. The phrase can include police officers, municipal law enforcement officers, special police officers, customs officers, state troopers, special agents, special investigators, border patrol officers, immigration officers, court officers, probation officers, parole officers, arson investigators, auxiliary officers, game wardens, sheriffs, corrections, marshals, and deputies

Knowing your job description would be a given.

 

[Whitebread]

Additionally protect and serve has been printed on the side of nearly every cruiser in North America and it means just that. Do I expect you to risk your life if need be? Yeah it's part of your job description. Do I want you to half to? No.

The difference here is likely motive. Do you run to gunfire because you want to stop the bad guy or protect the victims.

I hate to keep going back to Andy Griffith but old Otis was the town drunk, and every couple episodes he would tie one on real good and Andy would lock him up and let him sleep it off because he didn't want Otis to be any danger to himself or those in the public, but Barn found it unacceptable that a man would go out and get drunk in public because you know there are laws against that.

You said you want to win but you would have said we want the public not to lose. Do you see the difference? Because that's where I'm coming from on this stuff.

See I believe we are a nation of laws just like every other red blooded American. I just believe the purpose of the law is far more important than the letter of it.

 

[Emperor]

If you wasn't sure, why say anything? You sound like a news reporter that just has to be first, not right.

JR1572

Welcome Back!

 

[Whitebread]

Welcome Back!

Where have you been hiding? Flooded too?

 

[Emperor]

Where have you been hiding? Flooded too?

Pffft! The Emperor would never build his fortress in a flood zone; whether actual or theoretical. But I have been busy!

And what a wonderful day to tune in! JR's back, the Wabbit checked in; and I see a few other old timers that have been offline for a while too.

 

[JR1572]

Welcome Back!

Hey pal!

JR1572

 

[MOTOR51]

Additionally protect and serve has been printed on the side of nearly every cruiser in North America and it means just that. Do I expect you to risk your life if need be? Yeah it's part of your job description. Do I want you to half to? No.

The difference here is likely motive. Do you run to gunfire because you want to stop the bad guy or protect the victims.

I hate to keep going back to Andy Griffith but old Otis was the town drunk, and every couple episodes he would tie one on real good and Andy would lock him up and let him sleep it off because he didn't want Otis to be any danger to himself or those in the public, but Barn found it unacceptable that a man would go out and get drunk in public because you know there are laws against that.

You said you want to win but you would have said we want the public not to lose. Do you see the difference? Because that's where I'm coming from on this stuff.

See I believe we are a nation of laws just like every other red blooded American. I just believe the purpose of the law is far more important than the letter of it.

I tell you what, if I'm getting shot or god forbid a school is being shot up I don't give a **** if you are in the mindset of stopping the bad guy or saving the victims as long as you are running towards it and the end result is the same. You do come up with some ******** though.


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[Whitebread]

I tell you what, if I'm getting shot or god forbid a school is being shot up I don't give a **** if you are in the mindset of stopping the bad guy or saving the victims as long as you are running towards it and the end result is the same. You do come up with some ******** though.


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This is proof no matter what, you will never be convinced that maybe your way of thinking might be wrong.

The difference is quite important because your motivation changes your priorities which changes your tactics which has a great chance of changing the outcome. But you refuse to even consider any other points of view so I don't know how I help you.

 

[UnseenUSPCompact]

What is said: Cops are great with room for improvement to better help serve the community.

What is Heard: All Cops should let people shoot them.

Welcome to the new America.

 

[Whitebread]

What is said: Cops are great with room for improvement to better help serve the community.

What is Heard: All Cops should let people shoot them.

Welcome to the new America.

Potential meme. I'm kind of a dinosaur when it comes to stuff like that. Takers?

 

[MOTOR51]

This is proof no matter what, you will never be convinced that maybe your way of thinking might be wrong.

The difference is quite important because your motivation changes your priorities which changes your tactics which has a great chance of changing the outcome. But you refuse to even consider any other points of view so I don't know how I help you.

Lol. It's proof of something alright. I'm thinking what you have proved is that you are talking about something you know nothing about but think you do. If you have all the answers then maybe you should go get an application and try to fix it. Tell you what, when u need help with some accounting work hit me up, I have all the answers on that.


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