Lawmakers aim to curb military surplus program for police after Ferguson

323MAR · Aug 19, 2014

Leonidas said:
And some of the LEOs that are so special that know so much more than us lowly citizens are damned casual about collaterals. Friend those are real previously live people.

A few of you sound like I would IF I said after the next death of a swatter, 'meh, play military games, suffer military consequences. Tough sh1t, Sparky.'

You got it all wrong!(I mean that in a constructive way) Police are human like anyone else. Just pointing a loaded weapon at someone is scary enough and pulling the trigger on a person is the LAST thing that
a police officer wants. I have been involved in a fight for my weapon on two occasions. Both times I was afraid to shoot the perp. Both times I used my weapon to hit the perp several times before holstering my weapon and cuffing them. I thank God that I did not shoot them. These incidents are why I do not miss working the street.
You really should join a Reserve Division so that you can learn first hand about working the street. You will discover a whole new world.

alpinehyperlite · Aug 19, 2014

So im going to try to sum up some of the reasons people dont want LEO to have mil type of gear based on posts ive seen, and try to not put my opinion into it.

1. The LEO look too intimidating with riot gear on.
2. The LEO shouldnt have access to it, even if the same equipment is available to non commissioned personnel but is too expensive.
3. LEO need nothing but soft armor, and there is no reason for them to have anything more
4. I dont need police in my life, and can take care of it all on my own.
5. Police should only have “civilian gear” but cannot describe exactly what “civilian gear” is.
6. Police don’t need a tact’d out AR but should have a patrol rifle. What exactly is a Tact’d out AR? Flashlight, sling, VFG, optics?
7. Shouldn’t have “combat boots”.
8. LEO don’t need Kevlar.
9. Its not the equipment, its SOME of the officers that have them.
I Miss anything?

Who dat · Aug 19, 2014

It a sad day when the liberal, conservatives and libertarians are all sounding the same.

Not so long ago the Boston Police Dept, surrounding agencies and Federal Agents went to battle with the Boston bombers. They were well armed and threw improvised bombs/grenades at LEOs. The LE response was an overwhelming show of force and resembled a military response. They were heroes that day but racist jackbooted thugs in St Louis today.

This country and the world is crumbling before our eyes namely because of this administration, the media and the weak minded citizens.

323MAR · Aug 19, 2014

alpinehyperlite said:
So im going to try to sum up some of the reasons people dont want LEO to have mil type of gear based on posts ive seen, and try to not put my opinion into it.

9. Its not the equipment, its SOME of the officers that have them.
I Miss anything?

Bingo! I am sure that everyone on this board understands that lawful ownership of firearms and equipment does not cause crime because people commit crimes; not guns. The same is true for LE. It is just as unfair to paint LE with a broad brush as it is to paint gun owners with a broad brush.

ta2d_cop · Aug 19, 2014

323MAR said:
Bingo! I am sure that everyone on this board understands that lawful ownership of firearms and equipment does not cause crime because people commit crimes; not guns. The same is true for LE. It is just as unfair to paint LE with a broad brush as it is to paint gun owners with a broad brush.

Thank you...someone actually gets it.

CBlack · Aug 19, 2014

Perhaps this type of law will become more common place...

http://www.politico.com/magazine/st...police-killed-my-son-110038.html#.U_QI2_n-OSo

Tragic.

Rougarou · Aug 19, 2014

It's not the combat boots, its not the rifles, and its not the tasers I am concerned with. It is the tactics and the attitude. At one time police officers were considered servants of the community. Now they are its enforcers. Used to be when you passed a police officer and waved they would wave back or at least acknowledge your greeting. Now you're lucky to get a scowl in response. No knock raids need to be seriously curtailed. Why are police officers shooting nonviolent pets just because they can? Why are people being beaten or killed in police custody with no recourse? That is criminal behavior and must be stopped because at some point the public is going to say enough and it is going to be BAD. I hate to admit it because it is going to get rocks thrown at me from the LEOs on the board but IDGAF. I would have been fourth-generation LEO, but the second begged me to stay away for this reason right here. Your coworkers (and possibly you) are acting like a bunch of thugs. Do something about it.

In my personal opinion I think every law enforcement officer in the country should be required to wear cameras and that footage should be instantly available to the defendant upon request. It is the only way to reign in the lies on both sides of the badge.

ericlosh · Aug 19, 2014

Leonidas said:
The incontrovertable fact is that when confronted with a difficult argument, your go to tactic is to lash out personally. It's lame and transparent and invariably based on pure conjecture. Alinsky says, "You fail."

Madwabbit is helping any one concerned with leo militarization. The options he lists are far more effective than the forums. If one cares and has all this energy and serves it through the proper channels that are set up to focus those energies, then they may have a real impact.

Lots of people have solutions that don't involve them being part of it.

A lot of people have complaints but no way to fix it.

alpinehyperlite · Aug 19, 2014

Rougarou said:
In my personal opinion I think every law enforcement officer in the country should be required to wear cameras and that footage should be instantly available to the defendant upon request. It is the only way to reign in the lies on both sides of the badge.

In your opinion, when should said cameras be recording? How should the recordings be started and stopped?

323MAR · Aug 20, 2014

The cameras that the NOPD will start using begin recording with the last 30 seconds after the officer activates it. NOPD Officers will be required to activate the body cam just before any interaction with the public. It will not be constantly recording. Therefore, officers will not have their 10-42 on tape!

alpinehyperlite · Aug 20, 2014

323MAR said:
The cameras that the NOPD will start using begin recording with the last 30 seconds after the officer activates it. NOPD Officers will be required to activate the body cam just before any interaction with the public. It will not be constantly recording. Therefore, officers will not have their 10-42 on tape!

Issue I see with this sometimes, as any LEO knows, there is barely any time to turn on a portable radio, much less a camera as well. Also, even if it is just a few ounces, I disagree with any more weight being put on my body. My current every day loadout is almost 32 LBS!

323MAR · Aug 20, 2014

It will be a pain in the a$$ for NOPD at first. I can see officers forgetting to activate the cam. I can also see a problem with the patrols in the 8th District. If you are on foot for your whole shift in the Quarter, I just can't see constantly activating the cam. For those on foot, it can be too much of a distraction.

alpinehyperlite · Aug 20, 2014

323MAR said:
It will be a pain in the a$$ for NOPD at first. I can see officers forgetting to activate the cam. I can also see a problem with the patrols in the 8th District. If you are on foot for your whole shift in the Quarter, I just can't see constantly activating the cam. For those on foot, it can be too much of a distraction.

Not just that, but battery life without an external battery pack and memory. for it. You have someone working a 12 hr shift, with the camera recording, or even in standby the battery will not last near that long.

323MAR · Aug 20, 2014

Hopefully, your Dept will not use them. I do not know any officers who are happy about it.

Armed Mage · Aug 20, 2014

Rougarou said:
It's not the combat boots, its not the rifles, and its not the tasers I am concerned with. It is the tactics and the attitude. At one time police officers were considered servants of the community. Now they are its enforcers. Used to be when you passed a police officer and waved they would wave back or at least acknowledge your greeting. Now you're lucky to get a scowl in response. No knock raids need to be seriously curtailed. Why are police officers shooting nonviolent pets just because they can? Why are people being beaten or killed in police custody with no recourse? That is criminal behavior and must be stopped because at some point the public is going to say enough and it is going to be BAD. I hate to admit it because it is going to get rocks thrown at me from the LEOs on the board but IDGAF. I would have been fourth-generation LEO, but the second begged me to stay away for this reason right here. Your coworkers (and possibly you) are acting like a bunch of thugs. Do something about it.

In my personal opinion I think every law enforcement officer in the country should be required to wear cameras and that footage should be instantly available to the defendant upon request. It is the only way to reign in the lies on both sides of the badge.

I agree 100%.

If I do end up becoming a LEO I will buy and wear my own body cam on duty if my department doesn't issue them. Both to set an example as well as be able to prove my side of the story if I ever get involved in a controversial incident.

ctrues · Aug 20, 2014

Maybe I should start a company providing solar panels that you can wear on your back to charge the camera, or maybe a solar paneled ballistic vest and a beanie cap with a wind turbine propeller on top.

Vanilla Gorilla · Aug 20, 2014

Leonidas said:
And some of the LEOs that are so special that know so much more than us lowly citizens are damned casual about collaterals. Friend those are real previously live people.

A few of you sound like I would IF I said after the next death of a swatter, 'meh, play military games, suffer military consequences. Tough sh1t, Sparky.'

Coming from the same dude who a few weeks ago advocating the indiscriminate killing of anyone crossing the border including children. Impressive. Your still an ignorant coward.

Rougarou · Aug 20, 2014

I'm no electronics whiz but I gather it would be relatively simple to integrate rfid integration into the bodycams, i.e. when the officer exits the vehicle, the camera triggers. For walking patrols, constant - on would have to be policy. No real way around that.

jmcrawf1 · Aug 20, 2014

Rougarou said:
I'm no electronics whiz but I gather it would be relatively simple to integrate rfid integration into the bodycams, i.e. when the officer exits the vehicle, the camera triggers. For walking patrols, constant - on would have to be policy. No real way around that.

Except that the camera would have to be hardwired to a server to be able to accept all the useless data it would be amassing. It isn't feasible or cost effective to do that.

madwabbit · Aug 20, 2014

Armed Mage said:
I agree 100%.

If I do end up becoming a LEO I will buy and wear my own body cam on duty if my department doesn't issue them. Both to set an example as well as be able to prove my side of the story if I ever get involved in a controversial incident.

I did it. I figured "it'll set an example, and I'll have my very own episode of COPS"

Turns out even after spending 400 bucks I can only record 1/4 of my shift, and thats if I actually remember to set it to record. Thus far I've missed all my "cops" moments due to my reaction and response having nothing to do with my body camera. It sounds awesome in theory, but when it hits the fan the last thing you think is "okay, turn camera on...". If you just leave it on, you'll end up with a full SD card of your unit on patrol and no memory available when you actually try to turn it on later.

I find that most often I find myself saying SH*!. I didn't get that on film.

as stated above, technology WILL get to the point where its cost effective and practical. Today, it simply isn't.

Lawmakers aim to curb military surplus program for police after Ferguson

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